Anybody have any good ideas on how to get Creationists to actually tone in to your arguments and evidence? These people seem to be turned off as soon as you put forth any sort of evidence for Evolution and The Big Bang. Even if they pretend to listen I can usually look them in the eye and see that everything I’m saying is going in one ear and out the other. Maybe some cool analogy or something that makes them actually think about what you’re saying?
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Hate to break it to you, Justin, but it is highly unlikely there is anything you can do or say to get them to actually pay attention. You could pour concrete into the left ear, let it set, then seal it even more with solder and then silicon caulk. Then once you started talking into the right ear, it would simply start flowing out the right ear as fast as you could talk once it filled the brain to capacity without getting absorbed. And once you stop talking, everything you may have said would continue to flow out to the very last word. Nothing absorbed. It is though there is a logic-repellant coating on their brains in regards to their belief. Rather like Teflon on a frying pan.
It certainly does seem that way my friend. However, I have met plenty of Christians that are open to new ideas which leaves me hope. But then I take one look at my family who think that Ken Hams Ark Encounter proves that Genesis is literal history. Smh. *Face-palms self into next week*
What about sealing the right ear after you finish talking?
@Soyoz Re: "What about sealing the right ear after you finish talking?"
No, no, no! You have to seal that ear BEFORE you start talking. Otherwise, everything you say runs out just as quickly as you say it.
Tin-Man I am still laughing as I was drinking a beer when I read you response and it came spewing out of my mouth. Your sense of humor coupled with facts always cracks me up!
I needed a good laugh as I just had another argument with my christain room-mate. Seriously we need a reality TV show as she cannot stop telling me about jesus and I rant back and tell her how badly I want to burn in hell rather then worship her idiotic deity!
So as always thank you for the laughs and the descriptive way of showing how tone deaf they are and always will be!
@TLB Re: "Tin-Man I am still laughing as I was drinking a beer when I read you response and it came spewing out of my mouth."
Dammit, man! Sounds like a waste of good beer! ALCOHOL ABUSE!!!
Oh, by the way, you might want to get with Arakish about some of his personal "rules" for this site. I forget which number it is, but it has something to do with not eating or drinking anything while reading posts. lol
3) Thou shalt not be drinking or eating whilst thou art perusing forum boards for thou shalt never know when a post may cause great spewage.
I have been thinking of finding that file I started many years ago and starting a thread about it.
rmfr
HA! I had already found it. Was sitting on my desktop. Guess I was going to try and add to it.
Commandments When Perusing Forum Boards
rmfr
Have Kum By Ya playing in the background.
Begin each sentence with "Jesus Said."
Wave a Bible in front of their face as you speak.
Lie to them and promise them eternal life if they listen.
Begin by asking them if they have heard the good news.
When preachers try to get shit from each other they always say, "I was moved by the holy ghost to ask you / tell you ..... bla bla bla..... It really is how they manipulate each other.
Talk in tongues and then have a friend interpret the message you want them to hear.
LIE TO THEM - After all, that is what they are used to.
On a serious note, just ask them questions. Make as few assertions as possible. "What do you believe and why do you believe it." "How do you know that?" You must keep them on a single topic. They will bounce from topic to topic and issue to issue so you have to pin them down and keep them on the first topic being discusses. Don't let them divert. Keep bringing them back to the original topic of discussion until they admit that they do not know. There were some examples of this posted on the site not long ago.
First of all LOL. That was hilarious. And second, I completely see your point and agree that is a great tactic! The more I force them to see the issue without having to bring it up myself, the more I will get through to them. Theoretically of course
@Cog
Hey, you forgot the most important part to help seal the deal. Always remember to pass around the collection plate when you finish your spiel. That way they know you are legit.
Oh man....... How in the hell did I forget the damn collection plate! And if I really want to make some money, I find a family who just had a child die. I explain how poor the family is and how they can not pay for a headstone. I shed a tear as I pass the plate and explain how much I hate passing it to the kind hearted congregation, how I hate asking them for money but to please give from the bottoms of their heart (organ music begins to play softly in the background.) I raise my voice, YES BROTHERS AND SISTERS GIVE FROM YOUR HEARTS AND RELEASE THE FAMILY FROM THE BURDEN SATAN HAS PLACED ON THIS INNOCENT FAMILY. FREE THIS GOOD CHRISTIAN FAMILY FROM THEIR PAIN! FREE THEM FROM THEIR SUFFERING. IMAGINE IF IT WAS YOUR OWN DAUGHTER FOR SURELY IT IS YOUR DAUGHTER IN CHRIST. SURELY SHE IS ONE OF US/. FEEL HER IN YOUR HEART AND GIVE, GIVE GIVE.
Then I would take the $25,000 dollars I had earned, cut out $150 for the headstone, give it to the family, and by myself a small fishing boat because I enjoy being out in God's nature on the days I have no services to perform.
Justin, remember that not all your conversations need to have an immediate impact. Sometimes those words sit on a wee shelf in someone’s mind for a while after you’ve said them...they may get pulled down and dusted off for use later. Additionally, there can be folks in the periphery hearing the conversation. Those folks may be listening...and learning.
"How to get Creationists to listen?"
bruh....if they'll listen? there won't be any creationist at all....
In actuality, and ultimately, the only way you can get anyone of religious bent to listen to you is who is already doubting their beliefs and partially open-minded. Otherwise, you can forget it.
And this comes from experience. I have had a few persons who were already doubtful become "non-affiliated" from talking with them. I say non-affiliated because they did not become fully atheist, but at least they did become, what's another word...? Non-religious? Anyway, as far as I know, they may be fully atheist now. That was over 20 years ago the last time that happened. Basically as others have said, all I did was plant some seeds. Whether they grew or not...
rmfr
A Creationist does not believe what they believe for rational reasons. They tend to believe what they do because they believe that the universe has some divine purpose, and must be the work of a moral being otherwise there would be nothing to base morality on. Their particular flavor of creationism is more likely than not the same as that held by the person/s who raised them.
It is incredible hard to move someone away from this mindset. I cannot say that I have ever succeeded, although I'm sure that in many cases I have softened their stance, increased doubt, and generally given them something to think about. I am hopefully that will have a knock-on effect in regards their interactions with others, including notably their own children.
My strategy generally involves pointing out that their god is not a moral god, that a person needs no basis/justification for morality other than whether or not an action is good, that their scriptures are full of demonstrable errors, and that an uncreated creator god is a less sound explanation than simply making the universe the ultimate creator.
Yes, Sapporo, and I think that creationists would go as far as saying that "God" set up deceptive evidence on purpose, so that we would not come too easily to believe in "him". For them, faith is a virtue, and can be used to ignore good evidence which contradicts their belief in the existence of their god - after all "God" made things into a cryptic puzzle, with blind alleys, and switched 'road signs' - all deliberately. Only the foolish, (they would say), would fail to recognise that evidence cannot be taken at face value, nor any attempts to confirm or refute its implications.
So to Justin Scott @ How to get Creationists to listen? @
. . . quite probably no way.
You will never get them to listen again. New Research says all species came into being at the same time.
"Thaler and his co-author Mark Stoeckle of the Rockefeller University in New York discovered that nine out of 10 species on Earth today, including humans, came into being at roughly the same time — 100,000 to 200,000 years ago, AFP reported."
https://www.theblaze.com/news/2018/06/01/almost-all-species-on-earth-tod...
@Cog
Yep, they're seizing on Stoeckle's work already. Hemant Mehta wrote about it Patheos a few days ago:
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2018/06/04/young-earth-crea...
Never mind there's a big difference between 6-10,000 years and 100 -200,000 years- the Creationists certainly don't.
If they are bat-shit crazy, nothing you do or say will change their "beliefs".
But my argument is one of logic. For almost every activity in our lives, we use our brains and act in a rational manner. When we cross a street we look both ways. When we take out a mortgage, we go over the numbers, shop around. When we go shopping we select what we need/desire and have a reasonable expectation on the costs. But for the most important aspect of out lives, the biggest question of all time, some of us throw out all pretenses of being rational and sane, and bend our knee to something that may not exist.
This is logic:
https://www.theblaze.com/news/2018/06/01/almost-all-species-on-earth-tod...
EDITED FOR CORRECTION - This isn't very logical at all. Damn. I was really hoping the Creationists had scored a point. The game is almost boring because they keep getting skunked.
To hear you have to listen. When you are talking to them, they are thinking of a reply instead of reasoning or hearing your argument. They prefer to win a debate than the search for truth.
While raising my kids, I always looked for teachable moments. If I tried during a video game, forget it. It sometimes depends, like arakish said, they are at least partially open-minded or have some doubts.
Sympathy. Most of these people believe in the religion they do because they cannot find an explanation to their suffering. This may be because it provides a bit of comfort to them knowing some fatherly figure is looking over them. It would then seem if you treat them as delusional, you may have some understanding of their condition. Good psychologists can generally get the person to confront their delusion, in your case allowing you to provide your evidence and arguments
I wasn't going to respond to this and then I had an idea. "How to get creationists to listen?" Sit back and wait for them to evolve.
"Sit back and wait for them to evolve."
LOL, as if...