"Travis, the accountability is never foregone."

Having read the entire bible, I know for a FACT that it actually references "wiping out" or "washing away" of sin. It literally STATES that the accountability is taken upon Christ himself, and that you are to remit them.

"Each believer still has to give an account of his life to God."

"I tell you, on the day of judgment people will give account for every careless word they speak, for by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned.”

Hmm, I am pretty sure that atheists are people too...

"That person just makes it to heaven to be able to give their account. Without faith in Christ, a person remains eternally separated from God - a choice made in this lifetime."

I would like to see where you get this from, in the bible, considering I have never heard this particular twist on the judgement narrative.

"Yes, that is because sin has entered into the world."

That is rather obvious, if what you call "sin" did not exist, morality wouldn't even be necessary at all. Is this some kind of time-traveling tautology?

"God's nature is that He does not change."

Except for all the times he has changed his mind or his laws.

"This is the reason He gave the law to the Jews. It was so that they would realize they could not be saved by their own merits. In other words, the entire Old Testament of the Bible was forward looking to the Messiah. Once Jesus came to earth, He fulfilled the law. He did not abolish it. It was the realization that we needed God and we could not do it on our own that mattered. Ironically, the Jews did not recognize their own Messiah when He came and many still don't to this day. Although, that is beginning to change with the rise of the Messianic Jew (another fulfilled biblical prophecy). The purpose of God's laws via the Old Testament were to teach His people (the Jews) and by extension us (the gentiles) His standards. So God set the measuring stick for morality, but because we have a corrupted world and nature, our human nature chooses what is not of God - further evidence that Satan is the prince of this world."

I tried to parse this, I really did, but there is entirely too much here to reasonably address in one post. As such, I will stick with one thing. Have heaven and Earth passed away?

"Only because of sin."

Tautology.

"God's morality never changes."

Except that it, apparently, has. It used to immoral to eat pork and shellfish, or wear mixed fabrics, or even work on a Sunday. So, either it is still immoral, or it never was despite god stating that it was. Pick one.

"When reading the Old Testament, we always have to remember that the bible was written for us but not to us. We have the unique vantage point of hindsight - acquired knowledge of history, technology, etc. Take the old testament dietary rules for example, they were written for hygienic purposes - something we don't have to be concerned about in modern times. The law was written for the Jews for their protection as well as a test of their obedience to God and specific for the time period in which they lived. We no longer live under the laws of Leviticus because their purpose has been served. Jesus fulfilled the law and summed it up as follows:

Jesus was asked by one of the Pharisees, “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?” 37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’[a] 38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’[b] 40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.” - Matthew 22: 36-40"

Unfortunately, all you have done is demonstrate a lack of moral consistency, by all but dismissing the Mitzvot. Quite despite the fact that Jesus himself didn't, and actually stated that it should be obeyed by his followers, as he himself obeyed them.

"Yes, repenting of your sins is enough to be forgiven of them."

Then we don't agree.

"However, repent means to turn away with a contrite heart. Unfortunately, this definition is often twisted in that some believers feel it's enough to say sorry on Sunday and go right back to living the old way come Monday. This would not meet God's definition of repentance."

I don't really care how contrite the heart is, one should not be forgiven by pushing their sins onto another, that is a literal lack of responsibility and accountability I could not countenance in myself.

"If a man routinely rapes and kills small children until he is caught and prosecuted, finds Jesus and truly repents his crimes on death row, where does he go when he dies?"

"He goes to heaven."

"If a peaceful atheist man lives a very good life, never harming others and giving of himself to his fellow man all the days of his life, but happens to be gay; where does he go when he dies?"

"If he knew of Christ and rejected Him as his Savior, then Jesus told us he would not be in heaven. It is a heart and faith issue and not a behavior issue that determines where we go. Jesus said, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one can come to the Father except through me." -John 14:6

I know it's not popular to speak about (ironically, it's even less popular in churches these days), but I will say it again: this world belongs to Satan. He has this world. He had it the moment Eve took the bite of the apple (whether it was a figurative or a literal apple - I do not know, so please don't make this a debate point. I've never personally met a talking snake, so I will file this one in the "I have no idea" category). In any event, the part of this that I do know is that the world was made perfect before sin entered into it creating a giant chasm between God and mankind. Jesus is the bridge that brings us back to God's side. If you are not on God's side, then you will not be reconciled to Him. It will always be left as a choice for the individual since it's always a matter of faith, first. Do you put your faith in the world and yourself or do you trust one greater than yourself?"

That is a LOT of mental gymnastics to go through not to have to admit what your theology says on the subject, which is, if he is gay and never repents he will go to hell. This is one of the problems I really have with your religion(not you specifically), it is all about whether you repent or not, and not at all about being moral at all. This isn't even a question about morality to me anymore, because your religion isn't in my opinion, and my real frustration is the inability of believers to give a response without trying to justify what I see as an atrocity.

"Well, He's not just my God and I'm going to bet that He never wanted you to be an atheist."

Well, given that between the two of us, you are the one that believes he exists; you will have to excuse me if I consider him more yours than mine. As far as what your god wants, I wouldn't presume to know even if I thought it existed, as I wouldn't consider myself its equal if I did. That is perhaps, one of the things I find truly baffling about believers, their certain confidence that they "know" what their god thinks or wants in any given situation. Now this isn't exclusive to Christians, so don't feel like I am picking on you, but it truly does confuse me to some degree. It just seems like presuming to "understand" or "comprehend" something said to be truly omniscient and foreign to our thinking, seems a little egotistical.

I am told all the time by the religious that their god has a plan for me, and perhaps he does, and it includes what I am doing right this moment. Who knows. But if everything we do is "as he wills", to some extent a part of the plan, then perhaps we are all but actors on a grand stage; merely playing out our predetermined roles. One could hardly fault a philosopher for imagining such, given the circumstances.

"It can be frustrating when we don't receive answers on our timeline. I know He is there because of the answers to prayers I have received. Sometimes when I am in the midst of something that seems hopeless, it is only when I look back awhile later and realize that not only did my prayers get answered, but they were answered in a way far greater than I could have imagined. It just took patience and perseverance and faith."

Well, I am patient enough to enjoy Sudoku puzzles and physics, but I seem to lack your faith. I suppose we will see what we will see. I am in no great hurry, I am fairly boring and healthy, so I am really good at waiting.

"God has done amazing things with people that you would least expect. Take Paul in the New Testament - after Jesus' death and resurrection. Here's a Jewish guy named Saul, who hated Jesus and was bent on murdering anyone associated with Him. Jesus comes back to earth after His ascension, blinds Saul with a bright light while he's on his way to destroy more Christians, and asks him why he's persecuting him. He renames him Paul, and tells him to go back home and wait for more instructions. Saul, now Paul stunned and still temporarily blind, realizes what just happened, goes home to wait for God's instructions and then goes on as the primary missionary spreading the gospel message into Europe. God can and does amazing things - He turned a Jesus-hating, Christian-murdering thug into a missionary that brought the gospel message to Europe and ultimately to the rest of the world. While this was along time ago, it is still happening today. There are stories coming out of the middle east of former ISIS members coming to Christ. The real story here is that no matter what life we have today or what we think of our destiny, God's power, grace and mercy are far bigger."

I am fairly familiar with Saul of Tarsus, and his Damascus road experience, as I actually did study comparative theology as an elective course. The writings of Paul are the earliest Christian documents, and as such, are required reading in the portion dealing with Christian theology.

"I would love to hear back when you receive your answer and I would be more than happy to pray for you. Feel free to message me if there is something specific you would like me to ask Jesus to do for you."

I'll let you know, and I appreciate your offer, but I will leave the content of your prayers to your own discretion.

"Lastly, I want to say that I am surprised by the open-mindedness of many of your members on this forum. I didn't know what to expect when I replied to this post. While many are a little angry (which I do not take personally), many others including yourself have asked very informed questions. Ironically, I have found it easier to have an in-depth and enlightening conversation about God in this Atheist Forum, then I would have found in many churches. Who'd have thought."

Well, in general, those who reached atheism recently are usually the most angry. Those of us old hats, and those that were never very religious, generally aren't as hostile as interested in speaking to people of faith. I doubt you will convert me, and I doubt I will deconvert you, but that doesn't mean that we can't have a conversation which benefits us both without screaming obscenities at each other. Like I stated earlier, I have never heard this particular judgement narrative, so I learned something different today. That is one of my personal goals, to learn something new every day.