Has nature ever created a code?

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Sheldon's picture
Nothing in that post is

Nothing in that post is correct. Not one word.

Why do creationists brandish their wilful ignorance of evolution, as if it's a laudable achievement?

What objective evidence can you demonstrate for any code created by anything supernatural? At least we know for an objective fact nature and the material exist, can you demonstrate any objective evidence for anything supernatural?

Oh yeah, argumentum ad ingnorantiam fallacies, not very compelling.

Sapporo's picture
A million years worth of

A million years worth of accelerated mutations and mr fruit fly is still mr fruit fly.

What case are you citing? You are unable to produce any evidence that a thing that is different is the same.

LostLocke's picture
On a biological/geological

On a biological/geological timescale, one million years isn't really all that long.

J N Vanderbilt III's picture
Answer me this, are they

Answer me this, are they still fruit flies?
Or are they some other creature now?
I know I will not get a straight answer

Sapporo's picture
J N Vanderbilt III: Answer me

J N Vanderbilt III: Answer me this, are they still fruit flies?
Or are they some other creature now?
I know I will not get a straight answer

What instance are you referring to?

If you are able to disprove evolution, you are welcome to provide the evidence.

Sheldon's picture
What objective evidence can

J N Vanderbilt III, what objective evidence can you demonstrate for any code created by anything supernatural? Can you demonstrate any objective evidence for anything supernatural?

Sapporo's picture
I think it is noticeable that

I think it is noticeable that @J N Vanderbilt III has not provided proof that he is not a sheep-botherer. What are we to infer from that?

J N Vanderbilt III's picture
I guess that’s the non-answer

I guess that’s the non-answer that I was expecting.
they still fruit flies and NOT some other creature, no macro evolution here folks

Sheldon's picture
Trolling. QED

He's trolling. QED There is no argument against evolution.

Now

J N Vanderbilt III, what objective evidence can you demonstrate for any code created by anything supernatural? Can you demonstrate any objective evidence for anything supernatural?

So far you have given the non-answer I was expecting.

Sapporo's picture
J N Vanderbilt III: I guess

J N Vanderbilt III: I guess that’s the non-answer that I was expecting.
they still fruit flies and NOT some other creature, no macro evolution here folks

You seem to be asking us if it is possible for 1 to not equal 1.

No one is arguing that a single species is not the same as itself.

If you are able to disprove evolution, you are welcome to provide the evidence.

Sheldon's picture
Fruit flies are not a single

Fruit flies are not a single species anyway, as he has been told. The terms "fruit fly" and "Drosophila" are often used synonymously with D. melanogaster in modern biological literature. The entire genus, however, contains more than 1,500 species and is very diverse in appearance, behavior, and breeding habitat.

Do you ever wonder, when you read this nonsense from creationists if they are aware of how risible their claims are?

Chicken's picture
Do you expect them to turn

Do you expect them to turn into dogs or something? You’re rather off aren’t you?

Sheldon's picture
That level of ignorance is

That level of ignorance is pretty much standard fare from creationists sadly. If scientists produced an entirely new species of ape they wouldn't say well it's still an ape. Evolution has produced humans, chimpanzees, orangutans, bonobos and gibbons, are they all just apes to creationists one wonders? Nor was this the only example of observed speciation he was offered, and in response to his specious claim no one observed evolution so it can't be a scientific fact.

Sadly you can fight ignorance, but you cannot fight wilful ignorance like creationism.

J N Vanderbilt III's picture
I told you Sheldon, process

I told you Sheldon, process of elimination tells us logically and by observation that it takes intelligence to create a code w assembly instructions. What might that intelligence be?

Sheldon's picture
I never asked what you

Yes and I told you in every single instance that intelligent cause is natural, unless you can evidence an example of a supernatural cause? Not just a repetition of your argument from ignorance fallacy.

It's pretty simple:

What objective evidence can you demonstrate for any code created by anything supernatural? Can you demonstrate any objective evidence for anything supernatural?

So another non -answer from you.

Here's a clue, all the examples of intelligence we have are natural, we have not one example of supernatural intelligence.

arakish's picture
jnv3: "I told you Sheldon,

jnv3: "I told you Sheldon, process of elimination tells us logically and by observation that it takes intelligence to create a code w assembly instructions. What might that intelligence be?"

Although directed at Sheldon, I am going to throw in my two cents.

Process of elimination only works for one thing: Search Functions.

Logically, well you ain't shown any yet.

Observation: Please provide Objective Hard Empirical Data.

Intelligence to create a code: Only programming code. Good example is progam code that takes a three dimensional object constructed in cyberspace and instructs a 3-D printer to create the object.

What might that intelligence be? Certainly not yours.

The bullshit you keep spewing is just that Bullshit. DNA/RNA is NOT a code. We humans apply a code to make it easier to understand the assemblage of the DNA/RNA. Nature, nor any supernatural ghost, had NOTHING to do with creating any code. Why can you not get that through your thick skull?

Again, I implore you to study this PDF (Rhetological Fallacies) and learn where you are screwing yourself with all the logical fallacies you spew. And get this, I am offering it freely. The only payment you have to make is downloading, then studying the PDF.

rmfr

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Sapporo's picture
J N Vanderbilt III: I told

J N Vanderbilt III: I told you Sheldon, process of elimination tells us logically and by observation that it takes intelligence to create a code w assembly instructions. What might that intelligence be?

By your reasoning, as you are unable to prove you are not a sheep-botherer, you must be a sheep-botherer.

You argument that it takes intelligence to create something you deem intelligent only results in an infinite-regress, which is not something that can be proven by observation.

Sheldon's picture
He keeps insisting we only

He keeps insisting we only have examples of codes being created by intelligence, fine. Can he show even one of those examples where the "intelligence" isn't natural or indeed human?

Of course he won't answer, when he does he puts the last nail in the coffin of fallacious argument from ignorance.

J N Vanderbilt III's picture
“Here's a clue, all the

“Here's a clue, all the examples of intelligence we have are natural,“

Sheldon you also could have worded it “ all the examples of intelligence we have are from a mind”. You all know full well that assembly instructions do not form by happenstance yet you play word games to convince yourselves otherwise, that doesn’t wash

Sheldon's picture
It was your claim you, that

This claim that codes are only created by intelligence was your claim, that you have pursued throughout after all, so it's absurd to accuse me of word games now when asked to answer a single question about it.

So can you offer an example of intelligence that isn't natural or not?

Cognostic's picture
jnv3: I'll be more to the

jnv3: I'll be more to the POINT.. THERE IS NO FRIGGING CODE IN NATURE. DNA IS NOT A CODE. You are engaged in an equivocation FALLACY. The word CODE is only used as a place holder for "CHEMICAL INTERACTIONS." How frigging dense are you ? DNA is a dynamic chemical process and NOTHING MORE.

"All DNA is, to the chagrin of creationists, is a very, very complicated organic molecule that can react in a staggeringly large number of ways with other organic molecules. "

"As usual, this argument comes down to using words improperly."

"DNA is not an arbitrary set of symbols that “stand for” something else that will be interpreted through some kind of a legend. It is a set of chemicals which are nonthinking, and have no choice but to do what they do, in the same way that a crystal has no choice but to grow when in the presence of the appropriate aqueous solution. DNA is just a very, very, very complicated molecule that happens to be capable of facilitating incredibly complex sets of chemical reactions."

READ A FRIGGING BOOK!!!
https://livinglifewithoutanet.wordpress.com/2009/07/05/dna-is-not-a-code/

J N Vanderbilt III's picture
By natural you mean what?

By natural you mean what?

Sheldon's picture
J N Vanderbilt III "By

J N Vanderbilt III "By natural you mean what?"

You used the term nature in your OP, "has nature ever created a code?" and you insist that "all examples of codes are created by intelligence."

Now, can you offer an example of intelligence that isn't natural? No more evasion please, it's fooling no one.

arakish's picture
@ jnv3

@ jnv3

Then please show us these "supernatural intellectually created assemblage instruction codes" you are constantly babbling about. Those are your words pieced together from several of your posts.

rmfr

J N Vanderbilt III's picture
I believe I clarified that,

I believe I clarified that, meaning that nature is simply happenstance, not coming from intel. So given that, has a code/ assembly instructions ever materialized w out intel?

arakish's picture
jnv3: "I believe I clarified

jnv3: "I believe I clarified that, meaning that nature is simply happenstance, not coming from intel. So given that, has a code/ assembly instructions ever materialized w out intel?"

Never has. Never does. Never shall.

rmfr

Sheldon's picture
"I believe I clarified that,

"I believe I clarified that, meaning that nature is simply happenstance, not coming from intel. So given that, has a code/ assembly instructions ever materialized w out intel?"

Does any intelligence exist outside of nature and the material universe then? You keep making this appeal to ignorance fallacy.

So again I ask, can you offer an example of intelligence that supernatural or not part of nature? Again your constant evasion is fooling no one.

J N Vanderbilt III's picture
I did say multiple times that

I did say multiple times that via process of elimination , which is logical, it stands to reason that an intelligent mind has created the set of instructions called DNA. You admitted yourself that assembly instructions only comes from intelligent

Sheldon's picture
That's simply a repetition

That's simply a repetition yet again of your argumentum ad ignorantiam fallacy. You are ignoring my question, and I think we all can see why you refuse to answer. I made no claim about "assembly instructions" the phrase was yours and I have no idea what you mean by it, or what point you are making with it.

Does any intelligence exist outside of nature and the material universe ? Can you offer an example of intelligence that is supernatural or not part of nature? Again your constant evasion is fooling no one. If DNA were created by intelligence as you claim please demonstrate some objective evidence for that intelligence, with evidence and an explanation of how it created DNA. Not your fallacious use of argumentum ad ignorantiam.

arakish's picture
jnv3: "I did say multiple

jnv3: "I did say multiple times that via process of elimination , which is logical, it stands to reason that an intelligent mind has created the set of instructions called DNA. You admitted yourself that assembly instructions only comes from intelligent"

Please show us this "process of elimination." You keep saying this but have not shown the process you used. Please provide your step=by-step process. I want to see how you derived you "reasoning that an intelligent mind has created DNA."

I fyou cannot provide this process of elimination, then you are nothing more than an unfactual jester pawning off your version of Christianity.

rmfr

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