I asked a pastor questions on Homosexuality

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David Killens's picture
Peter 2:18

Peter 2:18

Slaves, in reverent fear of God submit yourselves to your masters, not only to those who are good and considerate, but also to those who are harsh.

Joshua, do you realize that if you use the bible to condemn homosexuality, you must also respect slavery?

Sheldon's picture
David Killens "Joshua, do you

David Killens "Joshua, do you realize that if you use the bible to condemn homosexuality, you must also respect slavery?"

Not to mention finding genocide, rapine, and stoning unruly children at the edge of town morally acceptable. Neither Bible or Koran can be considered moral guides, if you care remotely about avoiding the suffering of others.

David Killens's picture
@Joshua Pryce

@Joshua Pryce

"Thats why sex toys were invented"

https://www.amazon.com/Naughty-Inflatable-Sheep-Backdoor-Pleasure/dp/B01...

Bad Santa's picture
@David

@David
That pretty sheep looks a lot like Rudolf girlfriend... hm.. I better check his living quarters

Bad Santa's picture
Oh my, Joshua, I'm gonna have

Oh my, Joshua, I'm gonna have me some fun with your shallow claims!
You said:

Same sex is not meant to be. Mean arent supposed to sleep with men and women, women

It's not only meant to be but it's been happening, is happening and will be happening ALL THE TIME.

This one is just ridiculously GREAT@
You said:

Thats why sex toys were invented but it does more harm then good

Oh, so that's why sex toys were invented, to stop people of the same gender having sex??? AWESOME!
But I'm racking my brain on how sex toys do more harm... hm.. let me think.. OK I got it, If you wrap it, say, in barb wire?... that would fucking hurt!

You said:

God wouldnt say it is a sin if it was actually good for you.

Sex, regardless of gender, is not only good for you and science proves it, but it's also healthy and that's why gay people enjoy it and rightfully so.

Your god is a douchebag!

LogicFTW's picture
Well if his god says in his

Well if his god says in his "holey" book:
"that shalt not stick a lightbulb up your ass" he may just be looking out for everyone! But then that would just make too much sense, cant have that in a book full of holes! Oh hey you know what is also a hole? an assHole (Someone please stop me with the ridiculously stupid puns!!)

 
 

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Bad Santa's picture
No Logic, don't stop with

No Logic, don't stop with your puns, love them!! Keep going..
and "light bulb up your ass"? pretty cool idea, especially with Christmas holidays coming?... all those lights glowing, hm....

Tin-Man's picture
Re: Light bulbs in the ass

Re: Light bulbs in the ass

And thanks to LED technology, you no longer have to worry about them getting too hot and burning sensitive areas. *grin*

Sheldon's picture
Bad Santa

Bad Santa
"No Logic, don't stop with your puns, love them!! Keep going.. and "light bulb up your ass"? pretty cool idea, especially with Christmas holidays coming?... all those lights glowing, hm...."

Maybe you could patent a set of Christmas tree lights that double as a set of Chinese love beads?

We wish you a merry xmas, we wish you a merry xmas, we wish you a merry xmas, and an orgasmic new year....

Tin-Man's picture
@Sheldon Re: "Maybe you

@Sheldon Re: "Maybe you could patent a set of Christmas tree lights that double as a set of Chinese love beads?"

By golly, Sheldon, you may be on to something here! Outstanding idea! You could even make them vibrate to the tune of your favorite Christmas song. Wow! This is too good to pass up. I'm gonna be a millionaire!.... *looking up number to U.S. Patent office*....

David Killens's picture
Who says that Christmas comes

Who says that Christmas comes just once a year?

Rohan M.'s picture
Alright, here’s my Zeroth

Alright, here’s my Zeroth Commandment:

“Thou shalt not overreact to criticism of thy faith. If some do not agree with thee, then that shalt be fine. The fool hath said in his mind, ‘All shalt show unbounded deference towards my faith, and let it reign unchallenged forevermore; for any layman questioning my faith shall hurt my sentiments.’” ~Rohan 0:0

First Commandment:

“Thou shalt not treat one biological sex as inherently superior to the other, one sexual orientation as superior to the rest, one race as superior to the rest, or the two main genders as superior to the rest. And thou shouldst also get this through thy thick skull: All human beings are to be treatedeth as human beings.” ~Rohan 0:1

Second Commandment:

“Thou shalt not comforteth thyself with idolatries of the mind. Let logic, reason, and science guide thy decision-making, and let empathy and ethics be thy moral compass; for secular humanism shall trump myth and superstition.” ~Rohan 0:2

Third Commandment:

“Thou shalt not love an invisible, false friend more than thy fellow human being; for it wilst most surely cultivateth bigotry and poison within thy heart, and causeth division and an “us vs. them” mentality of sorts.” ~Rohan 0:3

Fourth Commandment:

“Thou shalt not make the vulgar fallacy of imagining that thou be’eth persecuted whenever thou is contradicted.” ~Rohan 0:4

Fifth Commandment:

“Thou shalt not be violent towards thy neighbor.” ~Rohan 0:5

Sixth Commandment:

“Thou shalt not own a slave for thyself. Always uphold the human rights and dignity of thy fellow human being under all circumstances.” ~Rohan 0:6

Seventh Commandment:

“Always enjoy each single second of thy life; for thou hast just the one. Let it not be wasted.” ~Rohan 0:7

Eighth Commandment:

“If thou cometh across beliefs that be ridiculous and exploded and yet demand unconditional respect, then let it be deserving of scorn, criticism, and ridicule. ‘Tis possible for thee to respecteth thy neighbor and their right to believe what they want to without respecting their beliefs themselves. And do not suppose that these unsubstantiated beliefs must be accommodated; for more and more accommodation will always be demanded of thee.” ~Rohan 0:8

“If thou faileth to follow the above 8 commandments, then fear not, for there shall not be any punishment after thy death, as there is no afterlife; only this one, short life for all.” ~Rohan 1:0

Diotrephes's picture
Rohan M.,

Rohan M.,

Those are the worse commandments I have ever read. There is no money to be made off of them. How will con men get rich and live lives of ease preaching those? Not one of them requires the sheep to fork over their money to them. Without structured rituals there is no need for ornate buildings. Consider all of the people who wont make money designing and building those places. And what about the special clothes and books and all of the other stuff? You need something about making pilgrimages to some place so that your relatives will have a source of eternal income.

Back to the drawing board and come up with something that will generate tons of cash for centuries.Remember, people only value something if they have to pay for it. The higher the price the more they will think it is valuable.

Tin-Man's picture
Hmmmm..... Thanks to Josh, it

Hmmmm..... Thanks to Josh, it looks like Tin-Man's Butter Knife is going to get quite a bit of use around here.... *chuckle*

Edit to add: For those who don't know, here it is....

"Any ridiculous nonsense presented will be countered with opposing ridiculous nonsense of an equal or greater amount."

Diotrephes's picture
AUS-LGBT,

AUS-LGBT,

"I asked a pastor questions on Homosexuality"

IMO the best way to broach such a subject is to first butter up the pastor and get him to agree on certain facts. You can start by rambling on about how you are having thoughts about certain issues and ask if he will be willing to help you with them. Of course he will usually be eager to do so and once that happens you have him hooked.

Start with casting a wide net. Get him to agree that he believes everything in the Bible. If he is foolish enough to say that he does then his goose is cooked. You have to ease into it so that he will gently slide down the slope. That is why you need to know the details in fairy tale.

After gently probing for a couple of minutes you can spring the trap. Based on his previous comments phrase the qestion in such a way that he will be a hypocrite if he doesn't answer it in accordance with what the Bible says about the issue.

As preconditions you want him to say that you should obey what is in the Bible. If he wimps out then you can hit him with "what about the Ten Commandments" and "what about the Sermon on the Mount"? Chances are he won't know what the real Ten Commandments are. Make him buy the whole thing without exception. Once he does that then you can hit him with something like this =

For example = Leviticus 20:13 (CEB) = "If a man has sexual intercourse with a man as he would with a woman, the two of them have done something detestable. They must be executed; their blood is on their own heads."

So then ask him if he, as a pastor of the faith and as a believer of everything in the Bible, is willing to execute a man who has sexual intercourse with another man. If he wimps out then ask him why he is cherry picking the Bible?

You have to be careful because he might fly into a rage and whack you upside the head. So always have some witnesses standing by to see that you get out safely.

AUS-LGBT's picture
I think I might've already

I think I might've already messed that up cause I asked this last night:

"I heard arguments that the stories in the bible are to be looked at for there meaning (a parable) and not to be interpreted literally, as though they were actual accounts. I was wondering if the stories of say Joseph or Sampson were considered parables? Because I have an issue with that if they do cause the parables in the bible are named parables, where those stories are not. And if they're not considered parables, do you genuinely believe there was a man who had unbelievable strength through the length of his hair? And had genuinely done what Sampson was written to have done?

Thanks"

Diotrephes's picture
AUS-LGBT,

AUS-LGBT,

All of the biblical stories are used to illustrate one or more of the Ten Commandments found in Exodus 34:11-28. The miracles are based on Exodus 34:10. When people heard the stories they were supposed to be able to identfy which of the Commandments it illustrated and if it was a reward or punishment story. The stories themselves were really irrelevant. They just illustrated the point.

In the case of Samson he was chosen to be special before he was even conceived. That idea parallels the story about Israel being God's chosen people. As Samson grew he broke the First Commandment, about mixing with the locals and taking their women for wives and worshiping their gods. And then Samson got punished for his "sins", just like the fairy tale includes countless stories about Israel sinning and losing favor with God and then being restored to his good graces. That happened with Samson. After he lost his strength and was blinded and held in captivity he was restored and went on to destroy his enemies. That theme is repeated throughout the Bible.

That is why it is essential to know what the real Ten Commandments are. Otherwise most of the stories appear to be senseless. Most of the stories, especially in the Old Testament, illustrate the First Commandment. They show the rewards for complete obedience and total loyalty and the punishment for disobedience and disloyalty.

All religions demand complete obedience and total loyalty in order to get to heaven or else you will end up in hell being tortured for eternity. It is a great way to get people to fork over their money to support the con men in comfort and luxury so that they don't have to work till they die. The Levites (Moses' group of thugs) worked the scam to perfection. They got the best of everything the poor slobs had and they got a premier retirement plan as well, with retirement at fifty years of age.

Numbers 8:23-26 (CEV) = "23 The Lord also told Moses, 24-25 “Levites who are between the ages of twenty-five and fifty can work at my sacred tent. But once they turn fifty, they must retire. 26 They may help the other Levites in their duties, but they must no longer be responsible for any work themselves. Remember this when you assign their duties.”

Remember, it is always about the money. You have it, they want it. If you believe in their line of bull shit you will be more willing to give it to them than if you don't believe in their fairy tale. A Saudi Arabian family has gotten wealthy off of the Mecca theme park because Islam says that every muslim should make at least one trip there in his lifetime. That is a gold mine. Is it any wonder why they get pissed about people renouncing Islam?

AUS-LGBT's picture
Oh so the story of Sampson is

Oh so the story of Sampson is not taken as a historical account then? Just want to make sure

Diotrephes's picture
AUS-LGBT,

AUS-LGBT,

Some people believe it is a historical event, just like Noah's flood and the universe being created in 6 days. But then they are idiots. You have to determine what the specific person you are talking to believes.

AUS-LGBT's picture
Thanks for that :)

Thanks for that :)

arakish's picture
Actually, the story of Samson

Actually, the story of Samson is a plagiarized rewriting of the much older myth of Herakles (Hercules).

rmfr

Diotrephes's picture
arakish,

arakish,

"Actually, the story of Samson is a plagiarized rewriting of the much older myth of Herakles (Hercules)."

Are you sure about that? It doesn't seem to fit the reported timeline.

The Hercules story was supposedly written around 600BC.

Samson was supposedly the last of the Israelite judges which places him about 600 years earlier, around 1200 BC.

If that is true, plus or minus a century or so, it would seem that the Hercules story was copied from the Samson story instead of vice versa.

In any case one of the points of the Samson story seems to be the idea stated in 1 John 3:9 (LEB) = "Everyone who is fathered by God does not practice sin, because his seed resides in him, and he is not able to sin, because he has been fathered by God."

Samson was one bad dude who committed all kinds of acts that are generally classified as sinful. But he is always protrayed as a good guy. He is never depicted as an evil person although his reputed acts certainly makes him one. So because of his alleged birth whatever he did was not classified as sinful. That idea is also expressed in the Jewish Babylonian Talmud which says that a rabbi can't go to hell because his good acts outweigh his bad acts, whatever they might be.

arakish's picture
The oldest Old Testament is

The oldest Old Testament is only dated to 450 BCE.

rmfr

EDIT: And when writing anything, the writer can just write that something happened 800 years ago...

Diotrephes's picture
arakish,

arakish,

"The oldest Old Testament is only dated to 450 BCE."

That may be off by a lot of centuries.

"Bible Possibly Written Centuries Earlier, Text Suggests
By Clara Moskowitz | January 15, 2010 04:32am ET"
Scientists have discovered the earliest known Hebrew writing — an inscription dating from the 10th century B.C., during the period of King David's reign.

The breakthrough could mean that portions of the Bible were written centuries earlier than previously thought. (The Bible's Old Testament is thought to have been first written down in an ancient form of Hebrew.)

Until now, many scholars have held that the Hebrew Bible originated in the 6th century B.C., because Hebrew writing was thought to stretch back no further. But the newly deciphered Hebrew text is about four centuries older, scientists announced this month. "
https://www.livescience.com/8008-bible-possibly-written-centuries-earlie...

The important thing to remember is that even if the Hebrews were writing 1000 BC it doesn't mean that they actually wrote the fairy tale that we have now. The fairy tale that we have now was written in the 680s-690s AD by a committee based in England.

Consider the dates for the various books on this site below. Are they logical given the reality of all of the wars and strife in the Middle East during those centuries? People are selling a con because they make money off of it. So they have to claim that it was written during ancient times instead of just over 1300 years ago. That's not to say that various manuscripts of vatious kinds did not exist with bits and pieces of the fairy tale but the books as we know them today simply did not exist. The committee in the 680s and 690s wrote those stories.
https://carm.org/when-was-bible-written-and-who-wrote-it

Old man shouts at clouds's picture
@ Dio

@ Dio

IMO the best way to broach such a subject is to first butter up the pastor

You got that wrong its normally Pastors and Priests who are big users of the lube organic or oil based...

Diotrephes's picture
Old man shouts ...,

Old man shouts ...,

If you butter them up properly you can screw them all day long. That is because their beliefs are not sound. If you can get them to crack on one issue them they are doomed, if you know the stories.

Take Moses and the Ten Commandments. The story says that he spent forty days and forty nights on the mountain without food or water and then he gugged the two heavy stone tablets down the mountain and broke them by throwing them on the ground. Now think about that. What happens to life forms on Earth when they do not get food and water? It doesn't matter what kind of animal it is or the kind on plant. It will die. From a medical standpoint what happens to the human body when it is deprived of food and water for an extended period? The blood chemistry gets out of whack, you lose muscle mass, and your organs fail. You will eventually die. So why didn't Moses suffer any harmful effects?

And guess what? He lugged two more heavy stone tablets up the mountain, went without food and water for another forty days and nights and then lugged the stone tablets down the mountain. He suffered no ill effects. Is that logical? If it is then why did the Israelites need quail and manna from heaven and water to drink? They could have done what Moses did twice with no ill effects whatsoever.
And you can bet that Moses was one dirty and smelly guy after those forty day vacations.

I think everyone knows most of the stories but they never stop to really think about them. His stink would have been powerful enough to have parted the Rea Sea all by itself.

Rohan M.'s picture
To really mess him up even

To really mess him up even more, you could quote the verses that tell you how to own a slave rather than not have one at all, and point this out. He’ll really lose his shit!

David Killens's picture
Why is god so fascinated

Why is god so fascinated/obsessed by what happens in the bedroom?

Rohan M.'s picture
Ever since I stopped

Ever since I stopped believing, I’ve been one to think that he’s so obsessed with what happens with the stuff in between our legs, that he might have some kind of sexual control fetish. Thank Goat he isn’t real!

Tin-Man's picture
Hey there, Miss AUS. Gonna

Hey there, Miss AUS. Gonna put my two cents worth in before reading other replies.

For starters, that pastor slipped and slid and ducked and dodged as if he was in a World Championship Dodge Ball tournament. Not once did I see him state his own personal view to any of your questions. He was basically hiding behind scriptures and giving all the patent answers a faithful follower should give. Apparently (as we all already know), a Christian thinking for himself and stating personal views is frowned upon when it comes to dealing with the type of questions you asked him.
Theist: "Well, the bible says this about that in so-n-so book and chapter."
Atheist: "Okay, fine. But what do YOU think about it?"
Theist: "I believe what the Word of God says, because His teachings are perfect and wise."
Atheist: "Yeah, yeah. You said that already. I want to know how YOU personally feel about it, though."
Theist: "It is a very touchy and complicated subject. And we mustn't let our own feelings and emotions guide us in the wrong direction. That is why I trust my bible to help me decide how to feel about such matters."

And around and around and around we go.... Pathetic...

Personally, I would have held that joker's feet to the fire and make him tell me straight up HIS answer to this question: "Do you PERSONALLY believe a person should be sent to hell just because that person prefers to have a consensual loving and physical relationship with an individual of the same sex?" And DO NOT allow the slimy eel to wiggle his way out of it. Saw Matt Dillahunty do that to a couple of ignorant theists who called in to the Atheist Experience. They tried their best to crawfish and sidestep the question, but he did not allow them to escape. Or, maybe it was him asking about if an atheist deserves to go to hell. (?) Anyway, either way, force them to answer the question. At the very least, it should be entertaining watching them squirm... *chuckle*...

Okay, now to go read other posts...

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