The Peculiar Math That Could Underlie the Laws of Nature

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Zale45e's picture
The Peculiar Math That Could Underlie the Laws of Nature

New findings are fueling an old suspicion that fundamental particles and forces spring from strange eight-part numbers called “octonions.”https://www.quantamagazine.org/the-octonion-math-that-could-underpin-phy...

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chimp3's picture
Particles 'spring from ..

Particles 'spring from ...numbers"?

Zale45e's picture
Dr. Furey want's to find a

Dr. Furey want's to find a set of rules involving octonions based on which we can derive the standard model of particle physics.

chimp3's picture
I am sure he does.

I am sure he does.

calhais's picture
She.

She.

calhais's picture
It's a stretch to say that

It's a stretch to say that what are currently believed to be fundamental particles`spring from numbers.' That's news hype for you.

I'm no physics major, but I've never seen a sum of nested summations requiring an ellipsis (p. 375: Furey's `SU(3)C × SU(2)L × U(1)Y (×U(1)X) as a symmetry of division algebraic ladder operators,' linked in the article). You can tell that I haven't done much applied algebra; I'm sure that sums like these come up all the time when studying octonions.

Also, does anyone know how to embed LaTeX markup on this forum? I had to attach that equation as a PNG image.

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Nyarlathotep's picture
calhais - I've never seen a

calhais - I've never seen a sum of nested summations requiring an ellipsis

It's a very common notation and it isn't required (perhaps required to make it compact enough to fit on one line). I've even used it on this forum.

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calhais - ...does anyone know how to embed LaTex markup on this forum?

LaTeX is not enabled.

calhais's picture
Thanks. Now I want to know

Thanks. Now I want to know the post you used it in. Do you know?

Nyarlathotep's picture
http://www.atheistrepublic
calhais's picture
Lacks summation nesting.

Lacks summation nesting. Still, it's nice to see someone remembers a little calculus. Did you major in physics for undergrad?

Nyarlathotep's picture
I did for a long time, but I

I did for a long time, but I eventually switched to mathematics.

Zale45e's picture
Would you contradict her

Would you contradict her conclusion?

calhais's picture
I wonder exactly what

I wonder exactly what `conclusion' you're talking about. The article, as usual, fails to convey her work.

Nyarlathotep's picture
I'm not sure what her

I'm not sure what her conclusions are, and even if I had them; they would likely be over my pay grade, in more than one subject. I'll just say:

As I understand it: she is trying to reproduce the standard model with this framework, and has had some success. There are lots of frameworks that have some success but never (or at least not yet) pay off. That being said: I think everything that has even a glimmer of hope should be tried!

Tin-Man's picture
Wow..... You guys are making

Wow..... You guys are making this math stuff waaaaaay more complicated than necessary. Look...

2+2=4

See how easy that was?

Oh, and if that thare Puhthaggerium Theeruhm is suppose-tuh be so dang ree-lie-able, then why ain't it called the Puhthaggerium FACT, huh? Explain that one, all you lottie-dottie math experts. Ha!....*folding arms across chest defiantly*...

calhais's picture
Because it's only reliable in

Because it's only reliable in the context of certain geometries and spatial metrics; facts describe conditions within observed rather than contrived contexts.

Zale45e's picture
Ever heard Geomancy?

Ever heard Geomancy?

calhais's picture
No, and it sounds like you're

No, though I probably have and just didn't know that it's called geomancy. It sounds like you're itching to tell, so go ahead, I guess. I've put off searching Google for your sake.

Zale45e's picture
It's difficult to explain it.

It's difficult to explain it. Its a mixture of math, astrology and unknown force. Me explaining it would sound like rainbow puke. Here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geomancy

calhais's picture
There is no math in geomancy.

There is no math in geomancy. There are some elementary applications of Euclidian geometry, but that's computation, not math. Geomancy is properly said to be divination, straight and simple.

arakish's picture
"... when interest in

"... when interest in occultism and divination began to dwindle due to the rise of the Scientific Revolution and the Age of Reason."

From the same Wiki page. This is why geomancy is just a bunch of bullshit being sugar coated and pawned off as a new age pseudoscience.

rmfr

Sheldon's picture
geomancy

geomancy
noun
1. the art of placing or arranging buildings or other sites auspiciously.
2. divination from the configuration of a handful of earth or random dots.

Geomancy tool

Geomantic instrument, Egypt or Syria, 1241–42 CE, by Muhammad ibn Khutlukh al Mawsuli. When the dials were turned, random designs of dots would appear, which were then interpreted. British Museum.
Geomancy (Greek: γεωμαντεία, "earth divination") is a method of divination that interprets markings on the ground or the patterns formed by tossed handfuls of soil, rocks, or sand. The most prevalent form of divinatory geomancy involves interpreting a series of 16 figures formed by a randomized process that involves recursion followed by analyzing them, often augmented with astrological interpretations.

Geomancy was practiced by people from all social classes. It was one of the most popular forms of divination throughout Africa and Europe, particularly during the Middle Ages and the Renaissance.

In Renaissance magic, geomancy was classified as one of the seven "forbidden arts", along with necromancy, hydromancy, aeromancy, pyromancy, chiromancy (palmistry), and spatulamancy (scapulimancy).

Knock yourself out...

https://scholar.google.co.uk/scholar?q=criticisms+of+Geomancy&hl=en&as_s...

Tin-Man's picture
Geomancy?... Sure! I LOVE

Geomancy?... Sure! I LOVE geometry! What's wrong with that?

Grinseed's picture
It sometimes amazes me Tin

It sometimes amazes me Tin gets past CAPTCHA. :p

Or is he only able to get in here when the answer is 4?

Tin-Man's picture
@Grinseed Re: "It sometimes

@Grinseed Re: "It sometimes amazes me Tin gets past CAPTCHA. :p"

Ain't gonna lie... I go through about one full notebook a week doing the calculations to post stuff on here. It is especially tough when the answer is over 18, because I am missing two toes.

Grinseed's picture
You are welcome to some of my

You are welcome to some of my toes. I don't use them for counting anyway.

Tin-Man's picture
@Grinseed Re: "You are

@Grinseed Re: "You are welcome to some of my toes. I don't use them for counting anyway."

Ooooooo.... Look at the funny lookin' bird braggin' 'bout his super math skills! "Hey, look, everybody! I can count without using my toes!" Well, lotti-freakin'-dah! I reckon that makes you one of them math geen-yusses. One thang fer sure, you ain't never bakin' no pie for me, Mr. Bigshot.

LogicFTW's picture
You can use the 12 base

You can use the 12 base system that much of the more clever ancient world used over the 10 base system. (counting the lines on the inside of your 4 fingers with your thumb. Can even go up to 24 if you use both hands, no toes needed.

Tin-Man's picture
Oh, and what's all this

Oh, and what's all this nonsense I hear about circles and pie are square? What kinda idget came up with that? Everybody knows pie ain't square. Pie are round! I tell ya what, I ain't never gonna let no math geen-yuss do no bakin' for me. Nope. No-sir-ee...

Zale45e's picture
Are there any other

Are there any other intelligent "souls" on this side other then @Tin-man????

By the way @Tin-man, the scarecrow with no brain fits you.

Tin-Man's picture
@Adam Re: Scarecrow

@Adam Re: Scarecrow

See? That's the problem! That over-stuffed sack of straw cut in front of me in line and that senile old "Wizard" ended up giving the brain to Strawboy instead of me. And since I ended up with the heart, and Leo got the courage, I've been too damn sentimental and too afraid to kick his ass about it. On the plus side, though, puppies and kittens adore me.

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