My apologies in advance that my first post here will likely be long-winded. I have no one to ask about this, so I am turning to you fine folks. I also apologize if I am not putting this in the right forum section, but I am not sure which is more appropriate.
I'll try to make this brief--I was raised in an extremely, ridiculously Christian town in rural Kentucky by two loving parents who are, to this day, intensely religious. (And due to a long list of circumstances, I am now back in that town, twenty years after I escaped.) My mother goes from church to church to sing (she has a professional voice and could have done something with that if not for marrying my father) and my father is a Holiness/Pentecostal minister. For those who may not be familiar with the Holiness concept, it is, in some ways, just a few steps removed from being Amish, without the restrictions against using cars and electricity, etc. Women obey their husbands, they cannot wear makeup, they have to have long hair, they must not wear pants or jewelry, etc. Though my parents were unbearably strict when I was a child (I could not go to movies, watch most television, listen to any music, go to most social gatherings with other kids, wear a pair of shorts or a shirt with words on it, etc.) they have lightened up a lot as they've gotten older. But they are still intensely Christian and intensely devoted to their "God." As a matter of fact, all of my family members on both sides are very religious, as is the vast majority of the residents of this entire county.
This is my problem--my wife and I are atheists. Even speaking that word around here is risky. My parents are fully aware that my wife and I do not believe in their religion and that we do not want our children to be subjected to it. But now that my older son is almost four, I am starting to notice that my parents are getting a bit more tempted to "share" their beliefs with my boys. It primarily has manifested because last year my father was suddenly diagnosed with an extremely aggressive form of prostate cancer and we all thought he was going to die. His only option was hormone shots, as the cancer was so advanced that nothing else was even offered to him (no surgery, no chemotherapy, etc.). He and my mother began going from church to church receiving "annointed prayer cloths" and my dad actually pinned about twenty or more of them to his undershirt and wore them constantly (and still does). I also noticed that suddenly index cards with LOTS of Bible verses had been handwritten and taped to certain spots on the walls all over their house. (Those are still there, too.) Eventually, the next time he went to the cancer doctors, they told him he was in total remission and they had no idea how that had happened. NATURALLY my entire family and everyone in all these churches genuinely believed all their prayers and prayer cloths saved my dad. (I, of course, find this entirely ridiculous.) I am more than thrilled that he is doing well, of course, because I love him.
But anyway, back to the point--recently I had a serious operation on my left foot and I have had a tremendously difficult time recovering. While visiting my parents about a week ago, they told me (to my shock) that some people from a church they'd attended had "annointed" and prayed over a prayer cloth for me. My dad asked me, "Would you be offended if I told you this and offered it to you?"
I replied, "Of course I wouldn't be offended. I can appreciate that other people might be concerned about me. That's nice. But I wouldn't do anything with the cloth if you did give it to me."
So I thought that was that. Then on the way to my car, my mother surprised me by making a point to say that they just knew those prayer cloths had healed my dad. I said, "Mom, I know that you and Dad believe that, of course I know what you guys believe. You raised me, after all."
This concerned me because normally they would not even go into that "territory" with me about anything. And that fact that they just did REALLY makes me worry that they might start proselytizing to my son. How do I make sure they understand that it is not their place to indoctrinate my children as they grow older WITHOUT hurting my parents' feelings?
Subscription Note:
Choosing to subscribe to this topic will automatically register you for email notifications for comments and updates on this thread.
Email notifications will be sent out daily by default unless specified otherwise on your account which you can edit by going to your userpage here and clicking on the subscriptions tab.
To be honest with you there is no way to do this but to forbid them from indoctrinating them, simple as that. Obviously this is hard to do because they are your parents. You need to let them know this gently as it seems like you have a relationhip with them that is caring and respectful.
Parents will always be annoying and difficult to handle but you really want your kids to have their grandparents. It's very important for them to bond.
I have not forbidden my kids from talking to their grandparents, I have not forbid my kids from going to church. But on the other hand I don't make them either. But when they are confronted by religion they can quickly see the BS involved. My kids and I do have long talks about how logical and rational thought processes work. Teach your kids how to think, not what to think.... It will go a lot further than you expect.
It's hard to be on your possition because it seems like your parents are very driven to believe in prayer as a meansto solve a lot of problems in their life. This reminds me of a relative that I have, he and his wife have 7 kids, and they can barely afford to take care of all of them. I asked them if they planned to finally stop having kids now and their answer was "we are having as many kids as the lord wants us to have". These kind of answers are scary to me. How can people truly believe such nonsense. God does not want you to have a shitload of kids that you are not even going to be able to support.
Same thing with cancer. This is a disease that will not be cured by a thousand prayers. Hundreds of thousands of people die of cancer every year all over the world and I'm pretty sure many of them had their entire family and friends praying for their recovery. Why would god favor some people and their prayers over others. Is it because of past mistakes made by the patient? or maybe because they come from a sinful family? That is the kind of logic that religious fanatics will use, and there has to be a way to wake people up from such a hypnotic state of mind.
The search for helping others open their mind is the responsibility of those that have been able to free their own minds from this fear and blind faith for god and religion in general. If you want to help your parents but you find yourself attacked every time you touch a subject they don't like, you can only separate your kids from their doctrines, and hope that they will be respectful of that. Tell them to be loving grandparents and to have fun and spend time with your children all they want, but forbid all attempts to force them to beleiev in anything without questioning it.
I will have to jump into this by saying that if parents get way to involved in your life as an independent person, you should demand that they stop doing so. There is nothing more disturbing than having religious people trying to mess with your childrens minds. It doesn't matter if these people are your parents. You need to put a stop to it and not care so much if they feel hurt. They should know better.
I agree with Walker here. It is up to you to decide when your parents have gone to far. But you must weigh what would be more effective talking to your kids or talking to your parents. However it is up to you to say when enough is enough if and when your parents start to go to far.
Thanks, Walker. Yes, I agree. And like I said, up until recently, I pretty much always knew that they wouldn't cross that line. They know better. It's just that after all this nonsense with my dad's "miraculous healing," they have become a lot more "gung ho" than they already were. They are constantly going to all these different churches and sharing his story, etc. It just makes me nervous.
Raise your kid to think critically. If he asks you, why don't you talk about god, explain him that you don't believe in god that you are an atheist, teach them about other religions and gods, let him get his own conclusions. Talk to your parents and tell them that although they have the right to discuss their god and praise it, they are not allowed to indoctrinate or force their beliefs on your children.
I agree that things will just have to play out. Obviously you can let your parents know how you feel about them speaking with your children but if it's not them sharing their beliefs with your children it will be someone else. When I was in middle school I was invited to church by so many of my classmates and I ended up going and being involved for a number of years but I eventually wised up to it and decided to leave. This is how it has to be, just encourage your children to always be comfortable and think about what they are believing.
First let me say based on what you provided for information here it seems like you turned out alright, I especially like the way you handled the prayer cloth for example, so I am not sure your kids will need all that much protection.
Well I can say that while my parents at least one of them was a little more relaxed about religion than yours were, I was very shocked I got a call from my sister and heard that my parent recommended my niece talk to me about god when she was having "trouble" with the concept. They did this knowing at least to some degree that my beliefs were vastly different than theirs. I spoke with them and my sister explaining my stance on the subject matter and to my surprise they all still really wanted me to talk with her even after I expressed my beliefs. The reason they recommended she talk to me is because I have studied many religions and they knew I grappled with the subject matter a lot as a child myself.
So I took a 4 mile hike with her and to sum it all up I told her basically that the concept of a god is very important to many people and it helps to give them structure, can help them cope with life, even give them reason to live and be a good base as well to help build a solid foundation of morals. I told her belief in God is important to different people for different reasons. I told her religious beliefs of others as long as they are not negatively effecting your life should be respected regardless of my opinions or hers I did not neglect to mention that her beliefs should be respected as well. I also told her one day she may see or feel a need for a presence of God in her life and that there was nothing wrong with that. I told her that nobody can tell her what she believes, her beliefs are her own and nobody can take that from her.
I think it would be good that your children be exposed to the culture that is a part of you whether you believe in it or not. Through their exposure to both their grandparents and their parents I personally believe they may become more well rounded. I think over time it will lead to them being more open minded and /tolerant of other viewpoints just be honest with them when they talk to you about it and if something concerns you, be willing to talk it over with your children.
New member here... I registered so I could post to this thread.
In certain circumstances, I think it's necessary to bite off a big piece and face the "witnessers" directly. Just this morning, I had to do that with my deeply fundamentalist family. It went predictably poorly, since they feel that every single action in this life has eternal consequences, and I was putting an obstacle in their divinely-commanded mission of bringing my tiny daughter to Christ. The only alternative to confronting their bald attempt at proselytizing was to let them (especially my mother) answer all my three-year-old's innocent questions with religiously-loaded aphorisms. Not that my child's questions were religious in nature, of course-- they weren't; the answers she was getting, however, were becoming more and more emphatically Jesus-oriented.
"I hope you remember this day; I certainly will" and "you realize this has eternal consequences" were two of the comments I got, among others. I stood my ground, tried not to be too aggressive in protecting my little girl's innocence, and felt sad that I had taken yet another step out of the family circle.
My child's innocence cannot be restored, once taken from her. At three, she deserves a few more years' insulation from the dark ideas that my family's religion conveys. She is still too young to comprehend that what an adult tells her isn't absolute truth.
The fallout from this episode is likely to be sizeable. It won't surprise me if things are very different from now on-- the reception will be quite icey from here on out, and it's just possible that I could be disinherited (I realize the disinheritance statement sounds wacky, but my mother's religious stance is rabid enough that she might see that as a way to show me the error of my ways). If so, I guess that's the price of doing what I perceive to the right thing.
This is a tiny nutshell of the way-too-long post I started writing when I first saw this thread a little while ago. I don't often participate in online discussions, but felt that this was one where I should pipe up, if only for the chance to air out what happened in a rational way (for myself).
Dale, it sounds as if your family isn't as militant in their religious practice as mine. For that, I'm glad. I think each of us has to be sensitive as to context, and follow our consciences where they lead. In some cases, we must do so regardless of the consequences for ourselves.
I appreciate your response, and I feel sorry for you as well, as I can relate. But you're right--it seems as though my parents aren't as "militant" as yours. They are especially less militant than they were when they were raising me. It was insane back then. They have both lightened up in some ways, yet they have also grown more devout at the same time. Less weird fundamentalist stuff these days yet more devotion to God at the same time.It could be worse, but it still worries me at times. Thank you for your comments. I appreciate them.
Establish that boundary with them. I will always love you, but keep the Jesus stuff in your house while I raise my kids my way. It's a good sign that they asked whether you would be offended about the cloth -- they're not going to be Philistine about it. And then tell your kids what you believe, while also letting them know that one of the responsibilities of adulthood is figuring out their own beliefs.