Earlier I started a post which morphed into a NDE convo. I would like ask for opinions on this:
many NDEs seem so detailed, and almost all claim they spoke to a spirit be it a deity or a family member who passed away telepathically. They also claim that these spirits tell them that every person will have a different NDE, as each person needs a different one for their life, and that NDEs vary sometimes across religions because different religions have different levels of spirituality. Opinions on this? How can hallucinations be so detailed, and many of the people claim they have absolute knowledge and every question in their minds is answered ex. One guy claimed he saw a demon, wondered how tall it was, and got an answer: 13 feet. Another woman wondered why NDEs vary, and suddenly got the answer: we all get different experiences unique to us.
Opinions?
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@Russian-Tank
For the last time, there is no validity in any of the near-death experiences. How many times are you going to start these stupid childish threads before you get it? I don't care how many YouTube videos you post, how many personal testimonies you cite, none of them are true. None can be verified or substantiated. So just fucking stop it!
how old are you RT? i'm just curious..
does these things bother your daily life?
where do you get this kind of thinking?
@Qu@si I'm 16 I do worry about it a little everyday. It's not too bad. I really have a hard time believing everything in religion, it's just that this last little bit is what scares me into still kinda believing.
You've explained it yourself perfectly; People are looking for answers and if the answers don't exist they will just make them up.
Well done.
You will find out when you die RT.
Until then live your life.
RT, no offense, bud, but I'm beginning to think you do not pay attention very well. Either that, or you intentionally choose to ignore what everybody is saying until somebody tells you what you want to hear. Either way, the answers on here will remain the same. Having been a medic and also from having dealt with a wide variety of mentally disturbed people over several years, I can assure you that NDE's can most certainly cause hallucinations that seem extremely real and detailed to the subject having them. And those hallucinations vary from person to person based on many, many factors to include culture, education, religious beliefs, etc. So, rest assured, you have nothing to worry about concerning devils and demons. Pretty sure you have better things to do with your time besides worrying about ficticious problems you create for yourself. Lay off the possession videos, dude. Check out some comedies. Hell, at this point, maybe you could even use a little porn. Just stop obsessing over death and demons already.
RT, the following are serious questions and are asked out of caring.
What percentage of your day would you estimate is spent concerned with the fears you’ve posted about? Do these fears ever prevent you from participating in activities with friends or family?
@CyberLN
I would probably worry about 25% of the day. These fears do not prevent me from friends/family activities. Thanks very much for caring CyberLN. I feel like I need reassurance about this topic. I know logically it's not real, it's just my fears override my rationality.
Well, then you seem to be giving away 25% of your life. Just think of all the very cool things you could do with all that time and energy!
When unreasonable fear overrides reality and consumes a quarter of one’s life, it might be time to see someone who can provide the tools to change that.
RT, it might be beneficial for you to set up some time with a person who can teach you those tools. Perhaps your school counselor could give you some names of peeps who could help you with this. I’m just not sure posting here about it is the only way for you to find a way to the other side of this.
@Russian-Tank: "One guy claimed he saw a demon, wondered how tall it was, and got an answer: 13 feet."
That's wasn't a demon. It was Denis Rodman.
Why would you expect hallucinations to not be detailed?
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People have been lying (to others and to themselves) for their religion longer than recorded history.
"Near death" is about like " near pregnant ".
Get fully dead, or knocked up - and then you' ll have a valid basis for an opinion.
@Russian-Tank: "NDEs vary sometimes across religions because different religions have different levels of spirituality."
I don't know what you mean by "spirituality", but any differences in NDEs are linked to cultural influences. People raised in Christian societies see Jesus or hell. Those raised in Buddhist or Islamic society see other things.
And what is an NDE anyway? It's a dream or hallucination experienced by someone who's ill or injured. They are likely to have been given pain-killing drugs. They are also likely to be suffering from concussion, shock, blood loss, oxygen deprivation, etc. Why would you attach any significance to half-remembered dreams experienced by people in that sorry state? It's just tabloid fodder.
I've been "dead" in an operating theater. I have no memory of any dreams or events, or even the passage of time. Five hours went by in just a blink of nothingness. I think that's what we all experience after death. No visions. No hell. No time. Nothingness.
Make the most of every conscious moment, and stop fretting about this NDE nonsense.
@Algebe, I see what you are saying, but all of these explanations don't seem to explain the NDEs:
Here are some arguments against current scientific ideas about Near Death Experiences:
First, Lack of Oxygen to the brain:
Hogan: Lack of oxygen causes stupor without memories of the experience. People experiencing NDEs report enhanced consciousness not stupor and they remember their NDE. “Dr. Fred Schoonmaker, a cardiologist from Denver, had by 1979 carried out investigations of over 2,000 patients who had suffered cardiac arrests, many of whom reported NDEs. His findings showed that NDEs occurred when there was no deprivation of oxygen.” The primary features of acceleration-induced hypoxia, however, are myoclonic convulsions (rhythmic jerking of the limbs), impaired memory for events just prior to the onset of unconsciousness, tingling in the extremities and around the mouth, confusion and disorientation upon awakening, and paralysis, symptoms that do not occur in association with NDEs. Moreover, contrary to NDEs, the visual images Whinnery reported frequently included living people, but never deceased people; and no life review or accurate out-of-body perceptions have been reported in acceleration-induced loss of consciousness.
Parnia raises another problem: When oxygen levels decrease markedly, patients whose lungs or hearts do not work properly experience an “acute confusional state,” during which they are highly confused and agitated and have little or no memory recall. In stark contrast, during NDEs people experience lucid consciousness, well-structured thought processes, and clear reasoning.
Next: Brain activity
NDEs cannot be caused by brain activity during CPR because CPR patients report confusion and amnesia while NDErs report lucid experiences. NDEs often begin before CPR is administered and the quality of consciousness and the pattern of events in NDEs does not change once CPR is started. Also, if consciousness in NDEs is caused by CPR, the patients should remember the pain of compressions and cracked ribs that sometimes occur during CPR, but NDErs do not feel the pain from CPR.
Finally, according to a Neurosurgeon named Greenfield: “”It’s very unlikely that a hypoperfused brain (someone with no blood flow to the brain), with no evidence of electrical activity could generate NDEs. Human studies as well as animal studies have typically shown very little brain perfusion (blood flow) or glucose utilization when the EEG is flat. There are deep brain areas involved in generating memories that might still operate at some very reduced level during cardiac arrest, but of course any subcortically generated activity can’t be brought to consciousness without at least one functioning cerebral hemisphere. So even if there were some way that NDEs were generated during the hypoxic state (while the brain is shut off from oxygen), you would not experience them until reperfusion (blood flow) allowed you to dream them or wake up and talk about them.”
Additionally According to Dr. Penny Sartori, medication results in a lower chance of NDEs.
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"Dr." Sartori is a Doctor of Theology. Nuff said.
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Don't cite crackpots if you want to be taken seriously.
@Nyar Re: Hogan and Sartori
Glad you found that info about those guys. I am not familiar with either of them, but after reading that "research" RT posted, I thought something smelled rather fishy about their claims. Now I know my suspicions were justified. Thanks for the digging.
*boom*
No explanation = no explanation, nothing therefore can be known. You keep brandishing ignorance of claims as if this means something can be asserted from this ignorance. That's a common logical fallacy called argumentum ad ignorantiam, look it up.
RT this shit isn't worth worrying about. You're 16. I'm sure you have a full life ahead of you. If you dwell on NDEs you will never fully live your life!
Mykcob4, do you think if we were to seriously test out of body experiments scientifically that they would fail?
They have been tested, and they always fail. It's total horseshit man.
@Nyarlathotep
Would you then say even if all the scientific theories for NDEs were debunked that it wouldnt prove NDEs as true? (Even if oxygen loss, medication, DMT were not the reasons for NDEs?)
@RT Re: "Would you then say even if all the scientific theories for NDEs were debunked that it wouldnt prove NDEs as true? (Even if oxygen loss, medication, DMT were not the reasons for NDEs?)"
Oh, lord have mercy! You reeeeeally need to get another hobby, young man. I have noticed from your profile history you have this unnatural fixation on death, demons, and hell. Not a healthy way to live. Watch some Monty Python. Watch some "Stupid People Fails" videos. Read some "Far Side" comics, or maybe some "Calvin and Hobbes." Hell, if you really are only 16 years old, then search for some bizarre porn sites like any normal teenage boy would do. Just get your ass away from the death and demons crap. And to reinforce what Cyber said, if you really are having that much trouble with this stuff, then seeking professional counseling would also be a great idea. We really do want to help you here, but there is only so much we can do through a keyboard, especially when you seem to not listen to what you are told.
Not at all! There is one way, and only one way to establish their reality (I mean that they are real events, not hallucinations or whatever). You should already know what the method is, but I'll include it for completeness:
They need to bring back verifiable knowledge that is not obtainable by mundane means. The fact that the one thing that would give credit to the idea, is the one thing the parapsychologists (aka crackpots) can't produce; should have your skeptic alarm screaming.
But it seems yours is defective when it comes to NDE's. You come back every few weeks and post the same basic thing (sometimes even copying and pasting your old material). You are being scammed, and I suspect you are a willing victim.
@ RT I don't worry about it. Testing would be a waste of time. How do you isolate hallucinations? NDEs are a form of hallucination.
What do you mean by fail? Nope, check that. I don't want an answer. This is an absurd subject that you keep bringing up every week or so. It's time to let it go, get off of YouTube, grow up and come to reality.
" do you think if we were to seriously test out of body experiments scientifically that they would fail?"
What evidence can you demonstrate for anything supernatural? Science is not required to prove invisible unicorns don't exist.
Russian-Tank, from the previous post you know I had a near death experience. I did not see any pearly gates, neither did I see fire and hell stuff. Neither did I see boobs, shame. The point it, it was nothing but a dream.
If other people's tale of their dreams bothers you so much to the point that an obsession is consuming a large part of your day, I say this seriously, see a medical professional.
Life should be enjoyed, every moment of every day. There should not be fear in your life, especially at your age. What kind of sick religion do you believe in, that torments you with such thoughts and concerns?
Good grief Tank, get rid that bullshit stuff out of your life!!!.
At 16 you should be having a ball...I bloody wish I were 16 again....you can save all that morbid shit for later when you are my age (64).
Here, I thoroughly recommend you watch this...
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=george+carlin
I consider offering you this a grand humanitarian duty...please do not offend me by not watching it ...or at the very least if you have to watch youtube vids just go watch something that has no bullshit stories and lying testimonies about life after death, demons and crap. Its all rubbish, mind rotting, life destroying rubbish. That's what everyone here at AR is telling you. Listen to them.
I'd love to be 16 again even if I know very well I would make all the same mistakes all over again....*sigh
@Grinseed, thanks! I will watch some of those funny videos on youtube, and it feels good to see people call it BS for a change. Most people on these scary youtube videos totally believe them so it's nice to get a change in thought
And everyone that believes this nonsense lives in fear. Does that not tell you enough?
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