How many people in this forums are pretending to be religious just to avoid problems with your family, or maybe to keep that job with your christian boss. Maybe you do it for other reasons?
I once did that with someone because I didn't want them to feel bad, but then I explained politely why I was no longer religious and the response was respectful. My advice is to always let people know how you feel about religion and the smart ones will understand and respect your decision, but never disrespect their religious choices either.
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I don't thinks is someone's business if you are religious or not. I don't go around saying I am an atheist. but if people ask me i'll stand for my lack of beliefs. I'm respectful to people whom respects me.
That's not really good advice if you live where being open about your atheism can get you killed.
I think this is the reason why religion should be erradicated. So many crazy people out there who would kill you for not believing what they believe. What a load of BS.
If you live in a region that people get killed for being atheists then you should move the hell out of there. Well, in all seriousness, just how savage can people still be to kill someone for not being a believer....it's amazing how stupid some people can still be.
I used to pretend to be religious, back when I first lost my faith and became an agnostic. The reason was that there are some members of my family - though not all - who are Christian, and I did not wish to upset them. Once I considered further, and realised that in fact my agnosticism was as unjustifiable as my faith had been, I then faced the fact that - as an atheist - I would have to tell those people sooner or later. Telling my mother was the hardest part. I must say though, to anyone who is still hiding their lack of faith, once you have told people it becomes much easier. Or at least, that is my experience. Good luck to you either way
I think most people just have to pretend because there is no choice. Some parents are so hardcore religious that if you go against their beliefs they will not even speak to you again. I for example would rather not speak to my parents than have to pretent, but my parents are smart people who respect my views even if they don't agree. It took some time but I got them to respect my views.
It is sad that some parents would disown their children permanently for not believing in God and this happens probably every day in this world. You are lucky to have the parents you do in this regard.
I really understand your question and think it definitely impacts Atheists all over the world when it comes to relationships. The thing is that to an Atheist there is nothing to lose when it comes to belief because heaven and hell is non-existent, there really is no worry whatsoever of life after death and therefore you could care less about someone's belief system. To a Christian, however, it is terrifying to think your son or daughter will not be with you in heaven and will be in hell so of course you will be upset (the downside to being religious).
The only family member I have been open with about my stance on God is my Grandma who is the most openly religious person in my family. She was fairly upset for a few weeks and even wrote me a letter saying she is ashamed of me and doesn't understand me which in some ways made me feel bad for having been open with her but at the same time frustrated about how she practically disowned me. She has since then quieted herself about it but I think she has convinced herself that deep down inside me I believe in God and that I am just talking for the sake of display.
Through it all I am glad I shared my beliefs and agree that ignorant people will choose to cut ties with you :/ They may come around though.
Well laid out there Lauren, there is nothing to loose really and its easy to make people happier so why not, no sweat off your back. There are people who will get angry hurt ect...
I am pretty open about my beliefs, but there are people I simply don't talk about them with unless I am hard pressed. With some individuals you just know it is not going to make anybodies life better to bring up what your beliefs are. But it is nice to have someone you can talk with, its nice to know that you can express yourself. When it comes to family it can make things harder on other members of your family if you let your beliefs out and why would you want to do that. It kind of make it selfish to do so in a way. I understand both sides however like Darklight, I was lucky enough to have parent who respected my views or at least one who respected them and the other who hopes to get us non believers into heaven one day! My parents may actually be a little more understanding than Darklight's were, but there are those people who will try even to physically beat the devil out of their kids.
Personally to me, I pick and choose my battles and sometimes it is just easier if don/t let my opinions be known, but sometimes I am left with no choice. I will not go into a church to help feed the hungry and throw my thoughts about God around. Quite frankly they would not be welcome there. I will however go and partake in the stuff religious people do from time to time. I guess this is because I don't hate them and I am not against them as a whole. Unfortunately, in the eyes of some, this makes me the most unforgivable kind of sinner, but since I don't believe, it's no sweat off my back.
true story,speacialy for me,I am a member of a musulman familly...what make thinks harder...so i live my way,do whatever i wanna do without leting them notice that i'm a true atheist,i would say that they may noticed that sometimes i say things out of the musulman contest..damn i am out of the musulman contest but i'm trying really hard to let not others find out what i truly beleive in!!
Great feedback here. I think the approach that Lauren and Zaphod gave is very good. You should simply let some people be religious because this is a confrontation that could hurt them more than we think. The older generations are probably going to die with their hardcore convictions anyways.
Working in IT, I've managed to live outside the religious mainstream. Very few people I know or have worked with are religious. Seems to be correlations with education and having seen more than one culture. Years ago when I was consulting, a potential client asked me if I was a Christian. I told him the question was illegal in the workplace and I was no longer interested in working for him, then walked out.
Hey Dave, do you build websites and if you do what are some examples you have worked on?
Being in a Catholic school I can see how it would be easier for me to tell everyone that I am Catholic, however due to the fact that they shove religion down our throats 24/7 I just need to stand up for what I believe in and what most other people in the school believe in too.
For example when we were learning about the water into wine story I shouted out "Jesus was an alcoholic" very loud whilst sat next to the teacher... yep :)
hahahaha that is funny lucyverse. I would have loved to have seen your teachers reaction to what you said.
She tried to pull it off and explain that it was a wedding so it was a celebration. But I just pointed out the fact that it had already stated that everyone there was already drunk.
I think this potential conflict definitely slowed my progression. I may avoid "getting into it" more so than I should, but I do not pretend. I don't walk about with the scarlet 'A' but have though about it :)
Monkey
I am a member of the 12 Step addiction/recovery community. I came to A.A. when I was a teenager (back in 1976). It was a time in A.A. when people were very liberal. No one really cared what others believed. However the popular belief was that recovery for addiction resulted form an intervening/interfering God that granted, recovery, serenity, wisdom and courage to the devoted. Kookie, I know. To be liked and accepted by the majority it helped to either speak the language, feign belief in a "God of our understanding" or be apologetic for your non-belief. Being that the big question for me at the time was "Do I really want to stop drugs and booze for the rest of my life!?!?!?" I didn't want to draw attention to myself while I plotted my escape. So, I am embarrassed to admit I talked as if I too believed that a supernatural power was something that I was open-minded about and I would try praying to, to help me stay sober.
I stuck around AA, as a closet atheist and I didn't come out until early this century. Since the internet, I found that there are 100s of AA groups for atheists/agnostics and many online communities for like-minded addicts/alcoholics. When I came out about my atheism, it strengthened some relationships and cost me others; no loss there. I wish I had a secular AA approach to latch onto right from the start. There are many more secular recovery peer-to-peer communities today but AA is where my closest friends are.
Long ago I would help my friend by going to AA when they would ask me to go with them. the whole church thing really turned me off. that and the fact that I have seen people meet drinking buddies there. to say the least I lost my faith in AA. I decided if I ever really wanted off the booze I would be on my own. I am glad to hear there are AAA (Atheist Alcoholics Anonymous) meeting groups out there for the less religious minded folk. Addiction can be quite an animal it hurts many people besides the abuser and for those that AA works for, I am glad it's there for them.
Even though I'm what's considered a cradle Catholic-I was baptized and not much else-I had a similar experience when I became an agnostic and later an atheist.
At first, I pretty much pussyfooted around the issue and pretended that I still believed. Then I began opening up to close friends, including my mom-who thankfully never converted to Catholicism, and began discussing it, which gave me more confidence in my opinions and reasoning.
However, things went downhill when my brother decided he wanted to be confirmed into the Church. He and my dad started pressuring me into doing the same. I waited until after he was officially confirmed to stand up for myself and announce my non-belief.
After numerous debates-which I kicked his butt in, btw-my brother relented and now accepts my opinions in the matter.
My dad, however, still refuses to recognize, let alone respect this. He still refers to my lack of faith as a "phase" I'm going through and insists that since I was baptized I will always be Catholic...I mean, how stupid is that? I was only a year old- was I supposed to do, bite the priest?
Anyway, that's the experience I went through. I know it's pretty tame compared to some horror stories out there, but I hope it helps others trying to assert themselves.
Your story is similar to what a friend of mine went through cookiemonster. It's funny about the "phase" your dad tells you about. I think it's 50/50 because I do see many atheists who do convert back into christianity for example.
I was raise into a Protestant family. My mothers side was very religious but my fathers side was not. I went to Catholic school and kinda went along with the whole Christian thing but never was like " I am a huge fan of Christ ". As I got older I started becoming more interested in learning in all forms. I was bored one night and checked out Bill Maher in Religulous. I was fascinated that someone was actually questioning religion. I was raise to just believe, but at that current time I was very shocked to see that most of his questions were rational. I understand that he may have not interviewed the brightest people but that was not the point. The point was that these people he interviewed were basic religious people in each of their own religions. I started watching his show of course from that point on. Found out that I generally agree with most of the things he says and questions. So as time went by I quickly became skeptical of religion completely. Now over a two years have past since this I have became not only a atheist but I believe a militant atheist. My mother and her new husband know now about my beliefs even tho we have never talked about it. (Facebook) They stopped praying before meals unless it is a holiday or something which leads me to think this. If they asked I would tell them however because I truly care for them I do not bring it up because even if you may think it is wrong I would insult their idea of believing in something without proof. I would bring up bible versus that conflict with their beliefs and it would end up with most likely my mother crying and my step father upset. I do hold to my beliefs and I am very open with it with people who either I know do not mind, or everyone I do not know. For the few friends now that are of strong faith I sometimes throw a little jab and then move the conversation to something else. They know how I feel. They know it is useless to try and convert me. I do however understand that I could be wrong. That there could be a god. But faith and delusion have the same definition. (Look it up)
Found your post very interesting. Why do you say militant atheist? To me it seems like a person may be more agnostic than atheist unless they know for sure there is no god. I'm kind of agnostic but more an atheist when it come to talking about any one religious persons particular god. Nice finishing note though at the end I'm gonna use it some time.
@ Trevor: I've also noticed a similar trend, like with a cousin of mine for example, but since I'm pretty set in my opinions-as my father found out-I just think he believes this to make himself feel better. That, and I know he went through his own "phase" regarding the Church after he and my mom divorced, so yeah. I don't really mind that much though...I still kick his butt when we do debate the topic :)
I'm glad that I don't have to deal with many religious people, and since most of the time I communicate with new people in business environment, they usually don't care about your opinion on religion. And since I read many articles like https://tweakyourbiz.com/sales/processes/contract-workflow on how to close deals, I don't spend too much time on communication in general.