Why are you an atheist?

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David Killens's picture
@Landon

@Landon

"You're the atheist. If you don't believe it is myth, than you would believe in a god. Also, if this is the case, then by what method is God proved to be a myth?"

You are the deist and making the assertion. it is incumbent on you to prove your assertions, not an atheist to disprove.

Your logic is extremely warped, to ask anyone to disprove any imaginary creature. I can do the same and demand you prove that invisible unicorns exist.

Absence of evidence is evidence of absence.

David Killens's picture
The talking snake is in the

The talking snake is in the bible. Do you agree that the talking snake is the kind of craptrap I was referring to, mythical nonsense?

algebe's picture
It was the rituals that got

It was the rituals that got my head out of the rabbit hole. At around 12 or 13 I started to wonder what kind of supreme universal power would care whether a bunch of kids sang "Onward Christian Soldiers", recited the Lord's Prayer, and slept through some pompous school principal's bible readings. It only looked sensible because we'd grown up amid it all and knew nothing different. But then I saw pictures of Muslims praying and wondered what all those silly buggers were doing with their arses pointing up at the ceiling. Then I realized that we were just the same. Once I started to think, all of the fairy tales came unraveled.

Are you any relation to Michael Landon of "Highway to Heaven"? That show gave me the creeps. The whole premise is that your god gives a tinker's cuss about people suffering and sends an angel to intervene. Have you looked at the world lately?

One of my loved ones is suffering from cancer. I go with her to the oncology clinic for chemo treatment, and she's making great progress. What I see there is dedicated doctors and nurses, and advanced technology created by science. Not one fucking angel. If Christianity had stayed in charge, monks would be treating her cancer with shit poultices and bones of saints.

WhyAreYouDecieved's picture
If an amazing boat is built,

If an amazing boat is built, and you look at it, and say, "That's beautiful!" and a day later, you find out that it was wrecked and everyone died. Does that mean the boat had no creator, because something horrible happened to it?

algebe's picture
@Landon If an amazing boat is

@Landon If an amazing boat is built

LOL! And if nobody came to rescue those shipwrecked people, would you conclude a) that there was nobody there to help, or b) that they didn't care?

And BTW, this boat we're traveling in is 70% underwater and we can only survive in a narrow space between decks. Great design!

Sapporo's picture
Landon: If an amazing boat is

Landon: If an amazing boat is built, and you look at it, and say, "That's beautiful!" and a day later, you find out that it was wrecked and everyone died. Does that mean the boat had no creator, because something horrible happened to it?

I'm not sure how your questions are relevant to the thread, unless you are advocating belief in a god that is known to have a creator.

WhyAreYouDecieved's picture
Not at all. What you just

Not at all. What you just said does not make sense. The person told me there couldn't be a god because the world is a wretched place. The world is the Lord's creation, but you deny that because the world is a horrible place. If the boat had a horrible design, that would mean it has no creator then, if that is how you think about it. Do you believe we evolved from apes?

Sapporo's picture
Landon: Not at all. What you

Landon: Not at all. What you just said does not make sense. The person told me there couldn't be a god because the world is a wretched place. The world is the Lord's creation, but you deny that because the world is a horrible place. If the boat had a horrible design, that would mean it has no creator then, if that is how you think about it.

Actually, when I said in my post that I initially became an atheist for moral reasons, it was because the god of the bible engaged in genocide and promoted torture.

Landon: Do you believe we evolved from apes?

Humans such as myself are apes. I believe that evolution by means of natural selection has the best predictive power for explaining how species arise.

algebe's picture
@Landon The world is the Lord

@Landon The world is the Lord's creation, but you deny that because the world is a horrible place.

The world isn't a horrible place, though horrible things happen. But there's certainly no evidence of design by your "Lord" or anything else. With our human intelligence, there's lots we can do to make things better. Unfortunately too many people surrender their reason to religions like yours, to the extent that they not only fail to contribute, but actively hold everyone back. Look at all the nonsense over stem cell research.

WhyAreYouDecieved's picture
Steam cell research takes

Steam cell research takes assumption and guessing, just like religion...

algebe's picture
@Landon: Steam cell research

@Landon: Steam cell research takes assumption and guessing, just like religion..

I'll take your word on "steam cell research", whatever the fuck that is.

Stem cell research is nothing like religion. It has the potential to unlock dramatic advances in medicine, but it takes science and hard work. The good thing about science is that there are very effective checks and balances. In 2014, a Japanese stem cell researcher published fraudulent research results. The fraud was quickly exposed and rectified, unlike the 2,000 year old fraud of Christianity.

WhyAreYouDecieved's picture
I know many Christian

I know many Christian scientists. Science is not a world view, unlike religion.

Nyarlathotep's picture
I'm still waiting to hear

I'm still waiting to hear about steam cell research; dumb nut.

David Killens's picture
@Landon

@Landon

"I know many Christian scientists. Science is not a world view, unlike religion."

Of course "science' is not a world view. It is a methodology, a procedure that has been proven to be the best method in determining the truth and reality.

I know many deist scientists too, but they are smart enough to be able to understand exactly what science is, and respect that process. And they also understand that when it comes to determining the truth, they do not turn to their holy books but instead use science. They know the difference between truth, which science is, and religion, which is just a comforting security blanket that at times is nowhere close to the truth.

David Killens's picture
@ Landon

@ Landon

"you deny that because the world is a horrible place"

I wish to extend my sympathies for your depression and pessimism. For me personally, this is a fantastic and wonderful world. Each day is a joy to experience.

David Killens's picture
@ Landon

@ Landon

"If an amazing boat is built, and you look at it, and say, "That's beautiful!" and a day later, you find out that it was wrecked and everyone died. Does that mean the boat had no creator, because something horrible happened to it?"

Whoa, back it up. Are you moving towards the old designer argument?

Because with great certainty I can find photographs, maybe videos, the builder's records, living eyewitness accounts, and appropriate paperwork that it was designed and built. All of these various sources of the same information tie in together and confirm that the boat was created. Whether or not the boat was wrecked, I can establish that the boat was designed and built by people with names.

WhyAreYouDecieved's picture
But the eyewitnesses of the

But the eyewitnesses of the Bible, who saw Jesus after he was crucified, don't count as eyewitnesses? Do your RESEARCH!!!

Sapporo's picture
Landon: But the eyewitnesses

Landon: But the eyewitnesses of the Bible, who saw Jesus after he was crucified, don't count as eyewitnesses? Do your RESEARCH!!!

Personally, I suspect that the Jesus of the bible didn't even exist as a historical figure.

It is known that people have survived crucifixion, so I'm not sure why you are emphasizing about Jesus allegedly being seen after he was allegedly crucified.

algebe's picture
@Landon: But the eyewitnesses

@Landon: But the eyewitnesses of the Bible, who saw Jesus after he was crucified...

Name one (with chapter and verse if you can).

WhyAreYouDecieved's picture
John 21:1 "After these things

John 21:1 "After these things, Jesus shewed himself again to the disciples at the sea of Tiberius; and on this wise shewed he himself."

algebe's picture
@Landon: John 21:1

@Landon: John 21:1

Who was John? Was John there when Jesus showed himself? When was John's account written, and by whom? Without those details, this is about as credible as an Elvis sighting reported in the National Inquirer.

WhyAreYouDecieved's picture
John the baptist is not the

John the baptist is not the writer of John. So you've done your research?

algebe's picture
@Landon: John the baptist is

@Landon: John the baptist is not the writer of John.

Who said he was? I never heard of John the Baptist writing anything, especially after he was beheaded.

His head is enshrined in Damascus, Rome, Amiens, Munich, and Kent.

David Killens's picture
@ Landon

@ Landon

"John 21:1 "After these things, Jesus shewed himself again to the disciples at the sea of Tiberius; and on this wise shewed he himself.""

I am familiar with the Gospel of John, which at best was written at least 90 years AD. So it was not John who wrote it. The best estimate is that the Gospel of John was authored by three individuals over a period of 25 to 30 years.

Thus we have a document that can not be dated, the author(s) is unknown. That does not exactly fall within the realm of verifiable stories.

Sapporo's picture
Landon: John 21:1 "After

Landon: John 21:1 "After these things, Jesus shewed himself again to the disciples at the sea of Tiberius; and on this wise shewed he himself."

Why do you believe this to be more true than Pride and Prejudice, or the quran, or the book of mormon?

David Killens's picture
@ Landon

@ Landon

"But the eyewitnesses of the Bible, who saw Jesus after he was crucified, don't count as eyewitnesses?"

Who? Names please, and provide references to any verifiable written testimonies.

Randomhero1982's picture
And the Romans, the greatest

And the Romans, the greatest civilastation at the time, who were brilliant record keepers make no mention if Jesus or his crucifixion... do they?

Not one account of the time it took place, not one mention of any guy with magical powers.

You have to wait decades after until Tacitus wrote what he'd been told about Jesus, and it's mere one single entry about a guy called Jesus.

Utter bollocks.

Randomhero1982's picture
And the Romans, the greatest

Most of the bible, if not all.. has been disproved, time to grow up.

Sheldon's picture
"If an amazing boat is built,

"If an amazing boat is built, and you look at it, and say, "That's beautiful!" and a day later, you find out that it was wrecked and everyone died. Does that mean the boat had no creator, because something horrible happened to it?"

If the boat builder was claimed as infallible, then yes, the claim would of course be highly dubious. Why do theists resort to such poor metaphors when it is clearly they who failed to understand the concepts they endow their deity with?

WhyAreYouDecieved's picture
Also, angel means messenger,

Also, angel means messenger, not savior. Again, do your research. I was an atheist once.

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