Your Thoughts/Beliefs on Pre-Big Bang Era

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Seek3R's picture
Your Thoughts/Beliefs on Pre-Big Bang Era

Hi there ,

My topic name might sound a bit weird but I just mean what are your beliefs regarding what happened before the big bang.

I do have some knowledge that there was a gravitational singularity that eventually gave rise to the big bang.

So, here, I think, are 4 kinds of people:

1) The religious ones: god caused the singularity and set in motion everything

2) The atheist-agnostic ones: we don't know yet what caused the singularity. But, it's extremely improbable that there was a god so I'll just be happy with "not knowing" or "unknowable" instead of filling the gap with god(s).

3) The deist ones: there ain't no religion and stuff but God was the one who started it all, END OF DISCUSSION. AND I DON'T CARE IF HE IS RETIRED NOW BUT HE DID IT!

4) The skeptically scientific: well, I don't have evidence for what I'm about to say but (theory name here e.g. multiverse, string or others if you have any of your own invented ones) seems to be the most probably one. Since in terms of logic and possibility it supersedes all others, I consider it to be the started of everything.

Soooooooo, what do you think guys (girls too, if any), about what caused the gravitational singularity? Do you fall in any of the 4 kinds of people are you a 5th unique one which I don't know of?

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Nyarlathotep's picture
Seek3R - I do have some

Seek3R - I do have some knowledge that there was a gravitational singularity that eventually gave rise to the big bang.

I wouldn't be so sure about that. The singularity talk comes from people running the model backwards beyond the point where the currently understood principles of physics breakdown. A dubious proposition.

That being said; to a modified version of your question, I'd probably respond with something similar to your #2:

I just don't know, and I don't think anyone else does either.

chimp3's picture
"Pre-Big Bang Era". How long

"Pre-Big Bang Era". How long did that era last?

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Seek3R's picture
Ah, cmon, I did rephrase my

Ah, cmon, I did rephrase my question in the opening para. Era is the wrong word but I don't know what else to use.

The point is, what are your beliefs about what happened before the Big Bang etc...

chimp3's picture
I don't have any beliefs

I don't have any beliefs about what happened before the Big Bang. I find science much more interesting than any fairy tale so I look to the physicists for an explanation. As of now, we may never know.

chimp3's picture
"Pre-Big Bang Era". How long

Ditto!

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Seek3R's picture
Did you attach something? I

Did you attach something? I can't see anything

chimp3's picture
No, that was a duplicate post

No, that was a duplicate post.

CyberLN's picture
Seek3R, you asked, “Soooooooo

Seek3R, you asked, “Soooooooo, what do you think guys (girls too, if any), about what caused the gravitational singularity? Do you fall in any of the 4 kinds of people are you a 5th unique one which I don't know of?”

I’m satisfied to wait for the experts to figure it out, if they can, and let us know...so I suppose I’m a combination of parts of 2 and 5.

Randomhero1982's picture
I would answer that

I would answer that everything that has occurred/happened after the big bang, has been of a naturalistic phenomena with no requirement for mystical cosmic wizards or any woo woo.

So I think if one was being a good bayesian, you could conclude that whatever preceded the big bang was also likely to have been a natural phenomena without the need of any theistic intervention.

Personally I dont think we will ever truly know the exact conditions prior to the big bang, but I am happy with that.

LogicFTW's picture
@OP by Seek3R

@OP by Seek3R

I will go with option number 2 mostly.

As far as I know, the big bang is the "wall" we cannot see past. In order to learn about anything we need some sort of way to observe and gain data on something.

I think it is likely impossible for us in this universe that in many ways got created by the big bang, to ever to be able to develop something in this universe that can in any way gain data about what was before. Every other observation and data collection we ever done has relied in one way or another what is already here in this universe.

In a sense our universe is our prison in that we cannot see before, can't escape and will not survive to see the "after." It is just a very large prison and we (or anything) is not being punished or anything. It just is.

 
 

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Cognostic's picture
@Seek3R: Now there is an

@Seek3R: Now there is an oxymoron. "Pre-big bang era" Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ,,,,,,, "Era: A long distinct period of history."
How does one not discuss "Time" when local time appears to have emerged with the Big Bang. Is this really the way your brain works??? It makes no sense to discuss "before" in relation to the Big Bang.

There is no logical discussion of "before" the big bang. "Before" may or may not have existed. All human knowledge ends at Planck Time. Physics breaks down at Planck time. Asserting that the universe came into being or that it is eternal is the same thing, a guess, and we have hypothesis for both positions.

4 KINDS OF PEOPLE: (I'll assume you are being hyperbolic here. If not, you are using a black and white fallacy simply extended to two more colors. It would be the black or white or red or green fallacy.)

1. Religious people. Not all religious people believe in creator gods.

2. Agnostic - Atheist: No one knows. There is no good evidence for a creator god (Evidence that can stand against critical inquiry.) There is no reason to make the God assertion.

3. (Exactly the same as #1)

4. Skeptically Scientific is not even in the same category as the other comments. It says nothing at all about God or gods. For the scientists that believe in evolution, string theory, multiverse or others.... If they are Theists, then their favorite theory is "JUST THE WAY GOD DID IT." If they happen to be "Atheists" then... there is just no reason to insert God into the mix.

WHEN IT IS ALL SAID AND DONE:
There is nothing one can say about "pre-Big Bang" You can not even discuss whether or not it existed without relying on bold assertions and unsubstantiated woo woo. You must ignore facts and jump to some leap of logic to discuss anything before the Big Bang. And before you do that.... you might want to get a degree in Cosmology or Theoretical Physics. As far as your break down of human types go, you have attempted to disguise a simple proposition by using fallacious elaboration. "God either exists or it does not exist." This statement in itself is a Black and White fallacy. At no point has the term God ever been adequately defined to suit all believers. While the statement appears to be true, until the term God is defined, no one can claim existence or non-existence. Many gods, in fact, are defined "out of existence." Attempts to define God into existence have all failed. That leaves us with naught.

Calilasseia's picture
Actually, if the mechanism

Actually, if the mechanism proposed by Steinhardt & Turok in two papers I covered in the past in this post turns out to be evidentially supported by data (the papers in question contain a testable prediction about the power spectrum of primordial gravitational waves, that scientists are busy setting up to search for), then that mechanism not only involves a well-defined pre-Big-Bang physics, but also eliminates the singularity problem from the Big Bang itself.

David's picture
Well, it's impossible to say

Well, it's impossible to say what there was before the big bang because we have no way of observing it, but my thoughts on the matter were there was another universe or at least something before us or there was nothing. This is just an educated guess on my part of the course and I just consider this a fun thought experiment.

Option one: A universe or some form of energy/ matter exists in the past. I can't tell what it was, but it could have existed. This thought goes back to the first law of thermodynamics: energy can neither be destroyed or created but transferred. Since mass is energy in another form, we can say that something was there before us. We can never be certain where this energy came from, I always found this a bit baffling, but if the statement is true, our universe might be one out of many renditions.

Option two: There were nothing and the odd law of quantum physics created everything. Science has found that virtual protons can pop out from the vacuum of space. Granted, they always pop out of nowhere in pairs and destroy one another right after. Yet we still are trying to figure out the laws that govern the universe. Maybe there something in that vacuum that can create a large explosion that is now our unvierse.

Nyarlathotep's picture
@David

@David

Kind of an extension of your Option two: a zero energy universe.

David's picture
I guess so. I just like to

I guess so. I just like to think of the possibilities out there. It what makes our universe so grand, we will never know the full 'truth of it.

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