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SBMontero's picture

Yesterday I spoke with @LogicForTW about transhumanism and the tremendous pseudo-religious restrictions on genetic research: stem cells, genetic treatments, organ replication; And biotechnology: exoskeletons, bioconnected nervous system studies, neuronal electrical map replication.

Don't you believe that, if bioethics committees of hospitals and research centers were removed from any kind of religious influence, such investigations would go faster?

What do you think about?



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algebe's picture
I think the bioethics

I think the bioethics committees are absolutely essential, but I do agree that all religious influence should be eliminated. I'm old enough to remember the first heart transplant and all the religious bleating about how the heart was the seat of the soul, etc., and that man shouldn't interfere in the realm of god. Bible babbling has also held back stem cell research, which is tragic for those affected by Parkinsons and Alzheimers, etc.

The role of bioethics committees should be to ensure that animals are treated humanely, that animal testing is not used for trivial purposes (e.g., testing lipsticks), and that humans are not used as guinea pigs against their will. Experiments on humans by the Nazis and by Japan's Unit 731 may have yielded important knowledge, but the price was too high.

SBMontero's picture
@Algebe: I had to swallow an

@Algebe: I had to swallow an article written by a son of a bitch, an evangelical pastor, who said, with all letters, that the exoskeletons being tested on paraplegic soldiers were an abomination because that was not God's will. Bioethics committees are essential, but when a hospital includes a priest in a bioethics council something is wrong, when in the report of a committee of bioethics we can read the word "god" something is wrong. That's what I'm saying.

LogicFTW's picture
Sure does seem like the

Sure does seem like the evangelicals host more than its fair share particularly crazy and nasty people.

SBMontero's picture
@LogicForTW: Lately, let's

@LogicForTW: Lately, let's say I'm talking about a couple of months, I'm reading things didn't read since I was living in Poland ten years before.

LogicFTW's picture
That is scary. And I do not

That is scary. And I do not even know the context of what your experience in Poland was like.

I feel much of it is the rise of the far right. Fortunately it looks like the far right choice in France will not win.

algebe's picture
@SBMontero: "when in the

@SBMontero: "when in the report of a committee of bioethics we can read the word "god" something is wrong."

I absolutely agree. In fact I wouldn't use "priest" and "ethics" in the same sentence. Priests are lying, parasitic, delusion peddlers with nothing to contribute to the well-being of humanity. Exoskeletons are great, but I hope we'll one day get to the stage of growing new limbs, spinal columns, etc.

SBMontero's picture
@Algebe: hahhaha "I wouldn't

@Algebe: hahhaha "I wouldn't use "priest" and "ethics" in the same sentence", that's a totally true sentence, yes.

The stage of growing new limbs, spinal columns, etc., depends on the research of stem cells and embryonic cells. The question is how long it will take to finalize such investigations if we continue to rely with the inference of religion on bioethics committees.

LogicFTW's picture
Not sure if this question is

Not sure if this question is directed at me or anyone interested in the subject. But in eithir case

1. I strongly believe certain aspects of transhumanism research and advancement would go faster if hospitals and research centers bioethical committees were removed from religious influence. An obvious example is: some religious followers problem with using embryo cells. Overall though, I think happily, it does not slow it down much, it is not a worldwide phenomenon. It will only put the countries that bow to religious demands behind in, a key technological area behind the ones that do not face this issue. Of course this does also greatly hamper the spread of making these technologies widely available, leaving the most vulnerable of people behind once again.

2. Wikipedia defines it as: Transhumanism (abbreviated as H+ or h+) is an international and intellectual movement that aims to transform the human condition by developing and making widely available sophisticated technologies to greatly enhance human intellectual, physical, and psychological capacities.

In some senses we have been augmenting our base physiology with technology since we started using the stick or rock. But that is a little different.

A more modern technology that greatly enhances us, is the computer with it's really long wires(and/or wireless) thing we call the internet. Conversation and knowledge sharing can happen in microseconds, in my opinion this already has a tremendous effect on enhancing human intellectual and psychological capabilities. However even this still may be off topic to the movement/definition above.

I believe transhumanism development has been happening for a long time, but it is going to greatly accelerate in the next 20 years. And it is going to make a lot of theist very nervous.

One, looking forward: it will seem like we give ourselves "god like powers." To that I say: If a modern US carrier fleet was transported back 200 years into the past, it absolutely would be god like to the people that lived at that time, we don't consider ourselves gods now.

Two, the incredibly technology and freedom transhumanism could offer will greatly undermine theism. Religions lose even more control over their followers. The spread of knowledge will be even more pervasive, even more beneficial. Transhumanism technology could point to more control over our minds. We could get an alert that pops up that our brain is flooding with emotion chemicals. We could turn off the parts of our brain that is associated with religious experiences. It is not the goal of transhumanism to do away with most major religions, it is just that the major religions ability and hold on people will be even further greatly eroded.

I could go on but this reply is getting too long I fear. :)

SBMontero's picture
@LogicForTW: It's because of

@LogicForTW: It's because of what you said of memory, confusing soul with mind. Imagine that a person's brain power map could be replicated and it could, let's call it that, transplanting to another device, we would end with senile dementia, alzheimer's and the vast majority of pathological and progressive neuronal degenerations.

Yes, the use of embryonic cells is a big example. I totally agree with you. That's the point.

LogicFTW's picture
Ahh. This is why I love these

Ahh. This is why I love these boards, all these great debates, that spawn new ideas and new debates. As soon as I get bored of one idea, we can start up a new idea to debate :)

SecularSonOfABiscuitEater's picture
@SBMontero. Yes I agree with

@SBMontero. Yes I agree with you. Religious "ethics" are a road block to progress.

xenoview's picture
H+ will happen with

H+ will happen with advancement in genetic, nanotech, and robotics. Humanity will evolve into a bunch of cyborgs.

SBMontero's picture
A cyborg is a human being

A cyborg is a human being formed by organic matter and technological devices that aim to improve the capabilities of the organic part. From that definition there are already many cyborgs walking between us, from those who carry pacemakers to those who wear artificial hips, knees and shoulders, to those who carry Cochlear apparatus, or cyber retinas.
Future is today.

CyberLN's picture
Another step in the

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