For months, I've been looking at the Refugee Influx in Europe, and it's only gotten me to sway towards the National side. I mean, sure my country's dominant religion is Islam, but as an Atheist and European I believe that the Koran, the Shariah Law, the Muslim Traditions and Ethics, including Clothes must be banned from Europe.
I'm not saying the PEOPLE should be banned, but those who are Refugees and practice the faith of Islam should not be allowed to practice their faith, or build Mosques. The people can live in Europe, in condition that they are fully merged with the Country's laws and social life and that they give up on their Eastern traditions.
I don't hate Arabic or Eastern people, I just don't think their Culture and Faith belongs to Europe, with that Refugee Influx, we Europeans are bound to become a minority. Plus, there are also crime rates increasing ever since the Influx and it's just making me hate myself for being Xenophobic, while at the same time making me feel I am making the right choice. I mean, I am a libertarian, a democrat, a supporter of LGBT rights, but why do I just not like Islamic or Arabic traditions or ethics....I even feel disgusted to have them integrated into our society and giving them the free will to expand.
I just seek counselling on this, I'm just confused.
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Xenophobia is unfortunately kind of a normal response. What you have expressed here is almost identical to thoughts expressed around the world, towards just about every foreign group you can imagine, for as long as history has been recorded.
/e
Here is a quick example:
Any of that sound familiar?
The same thing happened to the Chinese in New Zealand. Thousands of Chinese men were brought to New Zealand to work on road and rail projects, but no Chinese women were allowed. Because Chinese men were always in the company of other Chinese men, they were then accused of being homosexual. If a Chinese man even looked at a white woman, he'd be lynched. But the thing that really made them hated was the gold rush. White prospectors would work claims until all the easy gold was gone and then move on. The Chinese would then move in and discover much more gold through meticulous hard work.
When people are treated this way, they tend to form close-knit communities for self-protection. They shut themselves off from the local population and become very conservative about the old ways from their homes. Sound familiar? Every time an anti-Muslim, anti-immigration rabble rouser gets elected, 100s of young Muslims become radicalized and open to the poisonous messages of Al Qaeda and ISIL.
Just remember, if you go far enough back in history, we're all descended from immigrants and refugees.
It's weirdly, very similar if not exact. It's just the Arabic one, because for some reason I just hate their language and traditions, it just doesn't fit in my mind, it just doesn't belong in Europe in any way. And I know I'm wrong, at this, because both cultures, European and Arabic are rich, but I feel mine is more Superior and more Civilized than theirs. I just don't understand why do I hate it so much, is it because of the Religion or maybe Ethics, or maybe both. I just hate their Clothes, the way they pray, the way they practice their belief, it makes me feel as if I'm being put into a process of "Minorization", as if they're trying to destroy my Culture and replace it with theirs.
My country, Albania, was ruled by the Ottoman Empire for 500 years, and you'd expect me to be cool with it. But the history of my Country, the way my people accept Islam nowadays and call it "the true faith" (We were majorly Christians before Ottoman Rule) while at the same time expressing Religious Tolerance makes me angry. I actually feel it would be way better if we became Christians again and remove Islam, even as an Atheist. It feels as if my Culture is dead, mixed with Eastern ones, it makes me just want to change my entire Nationality. I just don't get it, I was always an Atheist, and this has been the only gate that's opened my eyes towards this World, the reason why I'm here.
@Endri: "And I know I'm wrong, at this, because both cultures, European and Arabic are rich, but I feel mine is more Superior and more Civilized than theirs."
In terms of material human well-being, you're not wrong. Liberal, democratic, capitalist protestant countries do better than all the others. Take a look at the Human Development Index (http://hdr.undp.org/en/composite/HDI). All of the top 10 are Western countries. Four are English-speaking, and six are European. The first Islamic country is Brunei at 31st. All of the few Islamic countries in the top 50 (very high human development) have been enriched by oil and gas money, which is really the product of Western technology and economic activity.
If you look more deeply at the list, you notice that Protestant or irreligious countries like Norway, Australia, New Zealand rank far higher than Catholic countries like Italy, Poland and Chile. Islamic countries with little or no oil, like Jordan and Egypt, are way down.
I wish there was a way to tell all these people that their religions are making them poor and killing their children.
Hi Endri. You're in a tough spot. Sorry for what you're going through.
Here are my personal thoughts about what you've written: It seems likely to me that there are two distinct things going on that bring you to this state. One is that you see the influx of a population that to a significant extent share a set of beliefs and practices that are antithetical to the positive, liberal values to which you aspire. You've noticed that a significant component of the incoming population is opposed to womens' rights, freedom of speech, sexual practices outside of what their beliefs advocate, and freedom of and from religion, among other things. Whether the beliefs and practices derive from a philosophy, political movement, religion, cultural set of norms or whatever, an individual who cares about themselves and others should rightly be expected to object. Not out of hostility or xenophobia or bias, but out of an intelligent response to an identifiable threat. I see no problem with this aspect of your response.
The second thing that seems to be a component is the triggering of core biases that reside within us all. We are quick to allow for all kinds of offenses by our in-group and quick to oppose even minor offenses from any out-group. This goes into warp drive when we have good cause to oppose elements of an out-group. That brings out something primal in us, or at least it does in me. Perhaps that primal hostility and protective predisposition has hold of your emotions and you sense it is robbing you of your rational response. Being aware of our tendency toward bias will help.
I'm rooting for you. Good luck with this.
You cleared out some things for me, especially in the first paragraph. I found it weird why I hated it, but the way you put it, I forgot the reason why. It's because of what they stand. I just realized that "womens' rights, freedom of speech, sexual practices outside of what their beliefs advocate, and freedom of and from religion, among other things." - is what I stand for, including the freedom of and from religion. This helps a lot, in my previous comment, you understand the my Nationalistic reason for this.
You cleared out some things for me, especially in the first paragraph. I found it weird why I hated it, but the way you put it, I forgot the reason why. It's because of what they stand. I just realized that "womens' rights, freedom of speech, sexual practices outside of what their beliefs advocate, and freedom of and from religion, among other things." - is what I stand for, including the freedom of and from religion. This helps a lot, in my previous comment, you might understand the my Nationalistic reason for this.
You cleared out some things for me, especially in the first paragraph. I found it weird why I hated it, but the way you put it, I forgot the reason why. It's because of what they stand. I just realized that "womens' rights, freedom of speech, sexual practices outside of what their beliefs advocate, and freedom of and from religion, among other things." - is what I stand for, including the freedom of and from religion. This helps a lot, in my previous comment, you will understand my Nationalistic reason for this. (Sorry, double-freak-out posts)
I hate it when I accidently post multiple copies of my posts! If you're like me, you winced when you saw these copy posts! I wouldn't worry about it ;)
That sounds suspiciously like Unilineal Evolution, you might find that an interesting read/sidenote.
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I think xenophobia and racism are both "normal" feelings for humans that many (if not all) of us experience from time to time. I think the best we can hope for is to identify them for what they are, and try not to let them influence us too much. I don't think there is anything wrong with you Endri.
I took a look at it, gosh, I really felt like a Neo-Nazi Supremacist.
Endri, if I had half of your self reflection ability; I'd be a much better person. Don't be so hard on yourself!
Exacly.
Endri, the mere fact that you are asking about it and reflecting on it shows you have a high awareness about it.
After a generation or two most immigrant cultures have assimilated into the larger culture. If you are afraid that Sharia is going to dominate your legal system perhaps your legal system is weak.
It's not that, but the increase of Muslim population and their children being Indoctrinated in the Islam really bothers me. Let's also include Muslim people who take political Roles or Imams who keep connections with Islamic Countries in the East. I just really feel as if a entire Army of Muslims is being bred and raised by our Western Government.
It's not that, but the increase of Muslim population and their children being Indoctrinated in the Islam really bothers me. Let's also include Muslim people who take political Roles or Imams who keep connections with Islamic Countries in the East. I just really feel as if a entire Army of Muslims is being bred and raised by our Western Government.
@ Endri -
Arranged marriages in India is not only prevalent but mostly a norm, so much co that the idea of a love marriage is looked upon as unfavourable to say the least or met with vehement opposition.
Thus most families insist on choosing the partners for their children. However whenever the children dare to chose for themselves (How Dare they.... but it happens.... more often than they want to admit) the parents are left with 3 alternatives.
1. They vehemently object but begrudgingly accept - In this scenario usually everybody is put off by the vehement objection and the sour puss attitude of the parents involved and the children instead of understanding feel persecuted leading to misunderstandings and eventually outright rebellion.
2. The accept readily and change their initial objection to acceptance - In this case the children feel that the parents are making a great effort to accommodate their choice and in return become more accepting of the parental inputs and requests.
3. In this scenario people go into insane tangents of honour killing and exile and whatnot ..... I shall not dwell on this point for now....
My point is that Influx into the first world of refugees is inevitable. Only the first world has the capacity to rehabilitate them and assimilate them and so is inevitable. There is no way that the refugees will come to India and Bangladesh or Pakistan and so on....
The question is You fear the effect their culture will have on you and this is the most crucial aspect as its not just their culture influencing you but your attitude towards them and the attempt to assimilate them in your culture that will have a profound impact on them as well.
I apologise for the analogy but thats the best I could think of considering I was in a similar boat until recently. (The marriage thing, not the refugee crisis.... I just saw a parallel)
Muslims are a Minority in India and Hindu muslim relations have been uneasy at best for a long time in our country. In the year 1992 there was a big riot in the city of Bombay where a political party (Shiv Sena) headed a campaign to rid themselves of the muslims and so went about hunting and murdering men women and children. rape and torture was commonplace.
The next BMC (municipal Election) the political party that spear headed this operation came to power by a majority.
Now in the year 2010 there was a lot of political chatter by the same party about people from a different state migrating to find work and this echoes to an earlier time in the same partys infancy where it had a campaign against such immigrant people. Now mind it, these were still Indians and predominantly Hindus, but the party didn't want them to come to Bombay.
Busses and cabs were set on fire and a lot of property was damaged. There was rioting and people were hurt. (not as bad as the hindu muslim riot of 1992)
My Uncle who is a muslim and a moderate muslim, who hates the Shiv Sena and has never voted for them nor likes any of them supported their anti immigration rhetoric.
The used the exact same lines. These people they bring drugs, Crime. They are different, not like us. Horrible people. Look at what they do, How they live !!!!
@Endri - Your courage to face your biases and address them is something we should all aspire to as a civilisation or even as a species. However I do not think that your bias is something inconsequential. People are generally weak and fearful and it is our fear that drives us to differentiate and polarise instead of allowing assimilation. In fact its our animal instinct of fearing the unknown, particularly if the popular belief is to shun a particular group of individuals.
The untouchables were and are despised in India and they are of the same religion. Same story in Japan. We hate what is not us especially if people support our dislike of them.
In 2002 there was a mass rioting in Godhra in Gujarat. An investigating team implicated the state ministry for masterminding the riot that went on a genocide against the muslims in particular and non hindu people Godhra and the investigation report claimed the involvement of the chief minister. The United Kingdom had banned the then Chief Minister (Narendra Modi) from ever coming to the UK else he will be charged with the death of 2 UK citizens who died in the carnage.
Today that very man is the Prime minister of India and he won on polarising speeches laced with xenophobia and divisiveness and he still wins based on the same rhetoric. UK had to change its stance on him as well and he gave rousing speeches there as well.
In Pakistan However the conditions are just as bad if not worse for the minority Hindu population there.
Our protective Instincts force us to mistreat and be wary of others and strangely we look for people to fight our houses and voice our biases. But maybe sometimes we need to move past them.
to conclude I would like to quote Nyarl -
"Father-in-law: "Because MSNBC presents news tailored to fit my world view. Ideas tailored to fit your world view are the most dangerous because it is easier to internalize them than foreign ones; even if they are false. These are the ideas you should be the most skeptical of."
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I'm suggesting you (and all of us really) should take my father-in-law's advise very seriously."
@Charvak: "The untouchables were and are despised in India and they are of the same religion. Same story in Japan."
The Japanese untouchables were originally known as "Eta", but in modern times they've been known by various euphemisms, such as "Burakumin" (Village People), "Dowa Chikumin" (Assimilation Area People). They are indistinguishable from ordinary Japanese, except that they have ancestors engaged in occupations that were considered unclean by Buddhists, such as slaughterhouse workers, leather workers, executioners and undertakers. Estimates of their population vary between one and two million.
Because they look identical to other Japanese, identification is difficult. Big firms hire special detectives to track down applicants' geneologies. The majority of Yakuza (gangsters) are thought to be from this caste. If you want to make a statement against this Buddhist discrimination, buy your clothes at Uniqlo. That company was founded by an untouchable.