Back to politics

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mykcob4's picture
Back to politics

I find it amusing that republicans/conservatives are endorsing Trump, even though they hate his guts. My guess is that they think that they can control him, that they can use him. The fact is Trump is using the republicans/conservatives. You can't control a completely corrupted person.
If you study history, even casually, you realize that Trump is no less a tyrant than Hitler, Mussolini, Stalin. He is an egomaniac. You can't control an egomaniac.

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Nyarlathotep's picture
Kind of a tangent topic: the

Kind of a tangent topic: the odds on the election are shortening. Clinton is now at -200, Trump at +200.

ZeffD's picture
Odds at the moment (Early in

Odds at the moment (Early morning in UK, 2nd Jun)
Hilary Clinton is 1 to 2
Donald Trump is 7 to 4
Bernie Sanders is 20 to 1
And Joe Biden is 33 to 1

Democrats to win 4 to 9
Republicans to win 7 to 4
Independent to win 33 to 1

Source: Paddy Power..
http://www.paddypower.com/bet/politics/other-politics/us-politics?ev_oc_...

I don't Trust Donald Trump to uphold the US Constitution if he had a choice.

Nyarlathotep's picture
Should we use UK fractional

Should we use UK fractional odds, US +/- odds, or Euro decimal odds?

As far as who I will vote for: I've been thinking about bring a die (dice?) of some kind to the polling station and rolling it until I get a result for someone other than Clinton or Trump; I just wish I could do it openly where people could see me (but they put you in a little booth).

ZeffD's picture
"(but they put you in a

"(but they put you in a little booth)". Most of us just walk in voluntarily.

chimp3's picture
As a nation we have lost the

As a nation we have lost the backbone for self government. The trend is now to elect nannies or tyrants. If reanimation of the dead was possible James Madison would crawl out of his grave and beat us over the head with his femur.

ZeffD's picture
Then he wouldn't have a leg

Then he wouldn't have a leg to stand on. It isn't "scaremongering" to say Brexit could well result in harm to the economy, Scotland leaving the UK... even London becoming an independent EU city and the 'rump UK' losing its permanent seat on the UNSC aren't impossible.
But there I go off-topic again. Sorry Myke.

mykcob4's picture
No that's fine. Your politics

No that's fine. Your politics is just as important.

mykcob4's picture
Another aspect of republicans

Another aspect of republicans embracing Trump is the fact that they stand to lose majority in Congress. The only reason they are supporting Trump is over a seat that is vacant on the Supreme Court. They have already violated the law by not even having regarded the nominee appointed by the president. They think that they can even obstruct the Supreme Court. It's clear that the next president will finish this appointment, but will in fact appoint two more justices. That scares the hell out of the republicans that have been getting away with treason due to Scalia.

doubleAtheist's picture
Republicans hate clinton more

Republicans hate clinton more then trump, not all though.. They rather create a bad name for their party then let us get a good one... Although i dislike clinton due to her lying and being against gay marriage a decade ago and switch back when the current president is all for it seems fishy, like she will say anything to get elected.. But trump is 5x worse..

mykcob4's picture
I don't know what you are

I don't know what you are talking about when you say Clinton's lying. If you are referring to Benghazi, then I think that you are wrong. If you are referring to emails, I think that you are wrong. When researching what and if Clinton has lied, you'd be hard pressed to found something that she actually lied about.
As far as being against gay marriage, Clinton was never against it, she was slow to endorse it. She felt that it was too big a change too soon. I disagreed with her but I understood why she felt that way. It was a fight she wasn't prepared to take on because she thought she would lose any gains for the LGBT community that they had already won.
Here's the thing about Trump. He wants S. Korea and Japan to fend for themselves. He wants to allow anyone to have and use nukes. When it comes to nukes, I for one don't want a maniac like Trump to have any access to nukes.
Here's a study of the biggest liars currently among presidential candidates:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/7/25/1405686/-Which-2016-Candidates-A...

Nyarlathotep's picture
mykcob4 - "When researching

mykcob4 - "When researching what and if Clinton has lied, you'd be hard pressed to found something that she actually lied about."

She is a politician; when you see her lips move, you can be sure she is lying. Does she tell as many and as serious lies as the other politicians? Perhaps not.

Just for openers:
http://www.politifact.com/personalities/hillary-clinton/statements/byrul...
http://www.politifact.com/personalities/hillary-clinton/statements/byrul...
http://www.politifact.com/personalities/hillary-clinton/statements/byrul...

CyberLN's picture
Please don't take the

Please don't take the following as an endorsement for Clinton...

You say that it's fishy for her to have changed her stance from 10 years ago. Well, seems to me that folks change their minds over time as they learn and grow. Personally, I find that a good thing. Not changing is something that, for instance, many atheists deride xtians for....2000 year old morals and such.
I guess I just don't get what is wrong with her supporting this now if, say, it is more representative of her current constituents than ten years ago.

watchman's picture
Quick question guys......

Quick question guys......

I keep hearing Trump saying he will "make America great again".....

This seems to be playing to a strand of the American public ....... can you tell me when America was great in terms of this pledge.

You see I'm pretty sure that the UK conservatives have a similar "yearning"... but in the UK's case it seems to be around 1950 to 1955 ...... just wondering when Trumps demographic consider the apogee of the US was...?

solidzaku's picture
He's probably referring to

He's probably referring to the 50's through until the economic downturn of the late 90's, when the US's geopolitical reach was at its apex. That reach curiously began to wane around the Reagan era, which I find hilarious, considering the 'Make America great again' line is derived from a Reagan quote.

The Republicans figure that they can eventually rope Trump in and tame him into a more Bush-esque figure. Funnily enough, they have better chances doing that with Hillary, when you consider her voting record.

Nyarlathotep's picture
Tzee - "He's probably

Tzee - "He's probably referring to the 50's"

Yes the golden age of America; including red scare witch hunts, separate facilities for black people, illegal interracial marriage, women not being able to serve on juries, and old people dying in the streets without medical care. Who could possible want to vote against that?

solidzaku's picture
Young, impoverished, female

Young, impoverished, female ethnic minorities? Couldn't really think of any terms that better describe Donny boy.

mykcob4's picture
A little update on current

A little update on current events of this issue. Apparently some conservatives have figured out that they can't control Trump so they have rescinded their endorsement of him. Albeit they happen to be mostly republicans running for reelection in blue states.

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/06/donald-trump-endorse...

chimp3's picture
They are upset because he

They are upset because he insulted a Hispanic judge. WTF ? He has been insulting Latinos , African Americans and Women since he first opened his big mouth and announced his running. What is new? How many red flags do those idiots need?

Sir Random's picture
Enough to paint the entire

Enough to paint the entire country red. With flags or rage. I don't think our politicians give two shits anymore.

mykcob4's picture
So the ongoing saga continues

So the ongoing saga continues. Will the GOP leadership denounce Trump or won't they. Today McConnell said that Trump must stay on message. Ha what a laugh. McConnell's message to the world is that it doesn't matter what you say as long as GOP's gain offices. You can be a racist and be in the GOP. In fact they prefer it, so long as it doesn't cost them votes. Racist, sexist, gender-est, homophobes, white supremacist, corrupt capitalist, war mongers, hate mongers, obstructionist, is what the GOP is all about. Now revealing it publicly is another matter. Trump is endorsed by every racist group in America. He knows it. The GOP knows it. But neither will disavow them.

Sir Random's picture
And this a a trend sown

And this is a trend sown throughout American politics, and why it is so corrupt. The Democratic system itself is not corrupt, but the politics/politions behind it......

ZeffD's picture
Well nothing new on the Trump

Well nothing new on the Trump saga from me and (not unnaturally) nobody seems especially interested in British/EU politics.

There is one important thing going on in the UK that I'd like to remark on. Many people (esp in England) seem to be voting Leave as they think it will decrease immigration, but some evidence suggests that the opposite could be true...
http://www.atheismuk.com/forum/?mingleforumaction=viewtopic&t=1300.0

Wouldn't it be ironic if many people voted to leave the EU because the truth was the opposite of what they believed to be true?!

Let me add a nice image summarizing Mr Trump's military experience:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/donald-trump-military-record_us_55ac...

mykcob4's picture
A simple update. Trump keeps

A simple update. Trump keeps criticizing Obama for letting muslims to enter this nation. First of all Reagan let in Omar Marteen's parents to the USA, NOT Obama. Secondly it takes at least two years for people to enter the USA from troubled areas, which includes almost all the middle east.
Republican's criticize the president for not doing enough to stop terrorism even though Congress won't approve an Obama Treasury appointee Adam Szusbin whose job is to close off funding that goes to terrorist organizations. What a bunch of hypocrites. Lip service is all we get from republicans and Trump.

ZeffD's picture
What strikes me is that

What strikes me is that nobody has 'crossed the floor' (changed party). Trump against Clinton who's endorsed by one of the most popular presidents worldwide and not one republican seems to have left and joined the Democratic Party. Even some Democrats and Sanders supporters apparently won't support Clinton.
That illustrates the extent to which US politics is hopelessly polarized.

People clearly aren't standing on principles. In their minds, I think Republicans are following an ideology. Perhaps many Democrat Party members are too and this is probably WHY it is polarized.

Do USAmericans really think there are two coherent ideologies at play and this is what politics and elections are about?

The three main causes of human conflict: religion, nationalism and ideology. Republicans especially are deeply afflicted by all three.

(I still think the first post on this thread is perhaps the most telling).

mykcob4's picture
Here's the rub. Since 1980

Here's the rub. Since 1980 when Reagan was elected, the republican party embarked on an ideology that circumvented negotiation and logic. They allowed business (corrupt corporations) to gain a stranglehold on the party. In doing so those corporations used there advertising tactics to popularize their agenda. Ginning up fear, racism, homophobia, to distract real issues. For example the "welfare mother". This was a tactic used by republicans and corporations to try and end Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, and welfare. It portrayed welfare recipients as lazy black women that had endless numbers of babies. The fact is that isn't the case with 99.9% of welfare recipients. Now the base of the republican party is so far gone, so entrenched in this fallacy that they cannot even negotiate with anyone on anything.
The Democratic Party has moved and filled the center, is willing to negotiate, is the only Party that gets anything done in government. The republicans are nothing more than obstructionist. They want to bring down the government and make no bones about declaring that fact. If that would happen then corrupt corporations could and would end competition, exploit people and customers, ruin the environment, embark on endless wars to obtain natural resources, even more than they do now.
Only one aspect of the USA political system is polarized and that is distinctly the conservatives. They are even polarized in their own party. Granted their is an element of Liberals that are going farther left, but not as far as you may think. Bernie Sanders is leading a revolution that started far before he actually took the helm of the movement. "Occupy" was born out of the need to end corporate corruption and control. In the long run the Democratic party and the Occupy movement are together but not actually in sync. The republican party is fractured beyond belief. This is evident in election results. Starting in 1980 the republicans started gerrymandering the districts. This resulted in small political powers gaining control locally but not nationally. Only the most extreme conservatives can win in those local elections, but nationally they fail. So republicans get control over the House and have a slim margin in the Senate, but can't gain the Whitehouse. This leads to a stalemate where Democratic Congressmen/people can stop republicans from destructive bills such as ending Social Security, because republicans don't have a big enough majority to win, but also the republicans won't let any appointee be confirmed, or negotiate at all on any bill.

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