Hi guys,
I'm back here after a pretty long time as a question has been bothering me. Some days ago I heard something about "El Limpia" in a movie and that just reminded me of two identical events that have happened with me. I probably asked this before but from a very different perspective and lack of details but it has been bothering me now as after the movie, I read about it more and there's extreme lack of arguments against it and more in favor of it. But seriously, don't think I'm making this up just because I saw a movie. The movie just reminded me of the exact event that happened with me, nothing more.
So here are the basics:
El limpia - it is a traditional Mexican spiritual cleansing process in which an egg, plant or something else (mostly egg) is rubbed all over your body while reciting religious prayers. Christians recite Biblical verses, Muslims recite Quranic verses and etc. Afterward, the egg is broken and the next step differs according to religions:
In Christianity and Islam, the egg is broken and if it contains any of the following, it means you have an evil eye on you or black magic.
1) Dark liquid
2) Awful smell
3) Dirt
4) Blood
5) Dead fetus
6) Pieces of hair
7) Cotton talisman (a small metal piece with Quranic verses wrapped in a paper and put inside it, then the whole thing wrapped by a cotton cloth with a cotton string to wear it around the neck for protection). Okay but in el limpia case in Islam and in what I've seen from 2 el limpias done on my family in the presence of me, the talisman is rusted, it is alone, no cloth is wrapped around it, there is no string.
In Mexican and traditional culture, the original method of doing it and the way it originated is like this:
Rub the egg all over the body while reciting some prayers or verses (never heard what the Mexicans recite, probably something local or what the elders taught them). Once done, a jar full of water is taken and the egg is broken and its content including the yoke is dropped inside the water. If you see any of the following in the shape of the egg or water, you have negative energy, bad luck, evil eye or something is fucked up in your life:
1) The egg whites have taken the shape of spikes and have glued themselves to the surface of the jar (inside the water) ---- something is VERY wrong and you have bad luck
2) The egg white and yolk are on the surface of the water ---- something is wrong
3) The egg contents settle at the bottom of the jar, inside water, taking no shape ---- nothing is wrong
4) The egg contents contain drops of blood in it which as I've seen, surprisingly doesn't spread around in the water. It is like thick blood which stays stuck on the yolk (you can google the images) ---- something is terribly fucked up and probably you have a hidden enemy
--------------------------------
My concerns? Here they are:
1) The el limpias done on our family were by two practitioners who claimed that they possess power over demons whom they have converted to Islam and they now help these practitioners to assist victims of black magic and evil eye. We went there because my parents thought some black magic is done on us.
2) The first guy took 10,000 units of our currency (not revealing currency name for privacy, but that much money is fucking too much). A couple, the man in the couple, referred us to him so we had to go to that "Someone's" house where the faith healer or whatever you call him was invited. After some long discussions of symptoms along with that couple and his wife and some in-law relatives and us sitting on sofas in the lounge, he asked the man (there was a couple, a man and a woman, they were the ones who told us about this guy and how he cured one of their family members by this same thing which he was about to do on us --- el limpia), to bring an egg from the refrigerator.
3) He asked for a copy of Quran and prayer cloth to be brought. This practitioner was wearing the traditional clothing of our country (please google it to understand what he was wearing and whether those clothes had a part to play in what he was about to do: "Shalwaar kameez"). Afterwards, he told EVERYONE to go out of the lounge, the couple, us, me, my bro, my dad, my mother and the lights of the lounge were closed and he asked for one candle to be brought in. After a while, some intensely loud blows from mouth could be heard. The total process was of 20 minutes - 30 minutes long after which we hard a cracking sound, the light was turned on and he the couple told us that the practitioner is done and we should go inside.
4) We went inside, saw the egg which was given to him by the couple, broken on the wall next to the door. There was a fucking awful smell, like seriously insane smell. We had to close our noses with our hands while me and my dad analyzed the contents and my mom talked to the practitioner as to what happens next. According to him, the contents of this egg were dug inside a grave and the demons he controlled dug the grave and took the contents out, put them in the egg and now we're all clean and good to go. No more illness will occur.
The egg as I said had awful smell, black liquid, dirt and rusted rectangular metal talisman of around 3/4 inch size. He said this talisman was also found dug deep inside a place and the demons he controlled took it out becxause that was the main source of black magic and problems. Me and my dad were quite surprised at that time as to how did this even happen. The egg was given to him by someone we knew, it's not like that couple were assholes or retards or something who'd do something as shitty as this.
A similar event occured, this was the last el limpia performed on our family. The practitioner came in our house and asked my dad to buy a carton of eggs. My dad went to the market, bought the stuff, came back home and gave all the eggs to him, as he asked.
He asked for a medium-size open circular stainless steel container with slanted 4 inch borders and asked to put rice into it. We had bought some rice so we did as he said. He then put the eggs on the circumference of this container, on the rice, and asked for a small tiny mirror, some incense sticks and asked for ALL the lights to be closed, everywhere in the house. He placed the mirror in the middle of the steel container, slightly pushed inside the rice so it stands still. The sticks were stuck behind it. He then asked for a mud container was like a small plate, just very thick and made out of mud, like something produced in a pottery session. This was placed upside down next to his steel container.
He lighted the incense sticks, and said that he's about to begin. He strictly warned us that in NO circumstance should ANY OF US ever look in the mirror because he'll be talking to the friendly demons he possesses and they'll search the entire country for any talisman or any suspicious thing which has been buried and his demons will take them out and put them in these eggs.
As I told you, the steel container had 4 inch slanted borders, so the practitioner had to bend down too much in order to see his face in the mirror. The process was of 40-50 minutes, in which he was talking to supposedly demons in the mirror, he'd laugh at times and talk in a slurred speech.
When everything was over, he changed the direction of the mud container, which was empty before and empty now, and started taking eggs from the steel container with rice in it, and cracking one by one.
2 of the eggs contained rectangular rusted metal talismans of 3/4 inch size, a dead fetus, some blood, lots of black liquid and brainfucking smell.
----------------------------------------
So what am I confused about now?
How can anyone put a metal talisman and dirt inside an egg and a fetus? In the second event, the eggs were newly bought by us. Everything happened infront of us though we may have left him unattended sometimes because obviously nobody suspected anything back then. Also, while the first guy did it for hefty amount of money, this second guy did it for free. Both were wearing the traditional clothing shalwaar kameez. I am mentioning this because that kind of clothing is too baggy and can easily used to hide something, if careful. Just mentioning.
So how the fuck is this possible?
The same thing is done in Christianity by priests and faith healers in Islam. The Mexican way is different but I want an explanation for all this, how can anything be put inside an egg, considering the egg was recently bought? I could've just said the events were bullshit if the egg used was brought by the practitioner. But it was not.
Any logical explanation?
Subscription Note:
Choosing to subscribe to this topic will automatically register you for email notifications for comments and updates on this thread.
Email notifications will be sent out daily by default unless specified otherwise on your account which you can edit by going to your userpage here and clicking on the subscriptions tab.
Do a controlled experiment, ask one of the practitioners to perform it with eggs you locate, purchase and retain until your ready to trial.
I guarantee, you could buy 6000 eggs and the fuckers will never pull it off.
I further would happily wager that of the experiment required they never get to inspect or touch the eggs before hand, they will not participate.
Why? Because its bollocks!
Welcome back Seek3R. I am very pleased that you now understand what a con is, and I am proud you are attempting to reveal any tricks.
All of the episodes you describe have a few things in common. The first was that the con artist totally controlled the environment. The con artist also wore clothing that contributed to the fake. The con artist was allowed enough time to perform distractions and also take advantage of lapses in observation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZ077DkAxQI
Hi David,
What do you think about the second one?
1) The environment is controlled by us
2) The eggs are provided by us
3) All materials and containers are provided by us
Do you think that he exchanged eggs?
But then, the question is, how can you place a foreign object inside an egg shell without breaking the shell and then also seal it in a way that it looks like a perfectly normal egg?
What do you think about the Mexican method (the original method)? Is there any scientific reason as to why the content of an egg may tend to float, sink or change shape in water?
Slipping an object into an egg is a well known stage magicians trick.
@Seek3R
If you witness the eggs being cracked, he swapped the eggs. He certainly had the opportunity. My video shows just how sleight of hand is effective and can fool people.
"What do you think about the Mexican method (the original method)? Is there any scientific reason as to why the content of an egg may tend to float, sink or change shape in water?"
I can make an egg sitting at the bottom of a pot of water float. I just wave my hand over the water. What you do not see is the salt I dropped into the water. The salt makes the liquid denser, the egg rises to the top of the water.
Here is a video of on how to make a confetti egg.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oxbVIaWQN1g
Pay attention to the fact that there was just one hole at one end, and at the end of the process, it was carefully covered over. Done correctly that patch is almost invisible to detection. When the egg is broken, everyone is always focused on the cracked areas on the side, and if done correctly, the con artist directs attention away from that one patched end.
The point to remember is that if this is done under conditions of the con artist (low lights, lots of distractions, loose clothing) then it is a con. James Randi had a million dollar challenge, awarded to anyone who could prove such nonsense. Despite over a thousand attempts, no one was able to claim that prize.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c0Z7KeNCi7g
I absolutely love your way of logical thinking. I wish I was as good as you in skepticism. Perhaps I have a long way to ago, or maybe indeed I have a long way to go.
Great response, thank you!
Seeker, where is the peer reviewed research into this?
We don't need to disprove a claim for supernatural magic, if all they have is an anecdotal claim that at its heart makes an appeal to ignorance fallacy, then there's nothing to investigate.
@Seek3R: Eggs with colors or things inside.
Sorry Seeker, this is one of the oldest cons known to mankind. It is a simple magic trick that I learned as a child. I can put dollar bills in eggs, all sorts of liquids, objects that look real but are made of sponge (popular with magicians) and a whole lot more. IT IS A CON, a magic trick done to fool believers and milk them out of their money. Here is the trick made simple from a cooking show. Create an egg, or anything else you like, with one simple little trick. (I learned to do this in 3ed grade art class.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRwhQ_IjG0Q
Greetings Cognostic,
I appreciate your response. On the other hand, I found the exact way of performing this trick. There's a small saw blade with a very tiny cutting disc which can be used to cut the egg's shell without breaking or denting any part(s) of it.
Once the part of the egg is cut, you can put anything inside, as per your liking. Afterwards, take the cut part of the shell which you have taken off and put it back on the egg and seal it off with a white wax and a powerful glue. The chosen glue must be powerful enough that when the egg is broken, the part you cut isn't the first one to rip off but rather it also breaks naturally as would a normal egg's shell.
For the final touches, make sure to hide all the traces of what you've just done. Your egg full of bullshit is now prepared. You may now con the fuck out of others by either using your own eggs (the one with the bullshit inside) or you can use the eggs of someone else. In the latter case, make sure you are good at sleight of hand as you will be required to exchange the provided eggs with your bullshit eggs. You must also learn to be very manipulative and smart as at any given time, you may be presented an opportunity during which you will have to carry out the exchange process without letting anybody know or creating suspicion about your awkward physical movements (for the exchanging).OH AND PLEASE, for fuck sakes, please, wear clothing which can be used to hide the original fresh egg. Either baggy clothings or bring along a bag which can hold the egg. Whether that original egg gets raped inside the bag doesn't matter. You got your money if you did it for bucks or you proved yourself to be supernaturally powerful if you did it for free. Now you may leave with a smile on your face and claiming that all negative energy, evil eye and black magic is gone.
EL LIMPIA HAS BEEN SUCCESSFULLY FINISHED. (Fuck those who practice this btw)
As David asserted, having this bullcrap performed in a controlled environment would embarrass the con artists to their death. Or worse yet, they wouldn't even participate.
Now you are beginning to grasp the picture. If the con artist is going after a lot of money, they will invest the time and effort in preparing high quality fakes and practice until their sleight of hand is undetectable. They will also alter their clothing (hidden pockets) so they can carry their tools of deception. They will even check out the neighborhood, and learn what kind of eggs are being sold in stores.
They tell the victim to go out and buy some eggs. The victim assumes that because they chose the store and bought the eggs, it was all random and beyond the control of the con. What they do not know is that the con had researched the neighbourhood and already had the types of eggs prepared in his hidden pockets. Small brown, large white, whatever.
I've seen this trick done with people's wedding rings and normal eggs. You give the magician your ring and a normal egg. He waves his wand or whatever, then opens the egg and the ring will be inside. How is it done: simple! The magician cracks the shell and shoves your ring inside before he displays the opened egg. The hard part is doing that without you seeing it.
I did not read entire thread, and I know I am a bit late to this conversation.
That said:
1. Eggs especially in the USA are sterilized and there is less then 1 in 10,000 chance you will ever get an egg from the supermarket that will have a fetus in it because the eggs are not fertilized to begin with. These eggs will also 99.99% of the time be utterly free of:
1) Dark liquid
2) Awful smell
3) Dirt
4) Blood
5) Dead fetus
6) Pieces of hair
7) Cotton talisman
2. You could further verify the correct egg (instead of a switch out via sleight of hand) by marking the egg. I would say boil the egg, but I imagine these people can spot that by feel. Marking an egg in a subtle way that only you could detect and not letting the person performing the "rite" to know about it. If they can magically cure you from a spell, they should also have no problem if you mark the egg in a way unknown to them.
I am very confident that if I was present I could show this to be the con that it is by simply establishing a "control."
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
▮I am an atheist that always likes a good debate
▮Please include @LogicFTW for responses to me
▮Tips on forum use. ▮ A.R. Member since 2016.
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
You can use this link to know more new things: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZ077DkAxQI/penalty shooters 2