hey guys what is the cause of anti atheist in your country
Donating = Loving
Bringing you atheist articles and building active godless communities takes hundreds of hours and resources each month. If you find any joy or stimulation at Atheist Republic, please consider becoming a Supporting Member with a recurring monthly donation of your choosing, between a cup of tea and a good dinner.
Log in or create an account to join the discussions on the Atheist Republic forums.
If only I was just "trolling"!
My own religion is the most vilified on this planet, so we don't oppose freedom of worship.
The ATHEISTS will soon gain control over the United Nations, they will eradicate religion from the face of the earth.
The Bible said for a short while they will experience relative peace but suddenly the people under them will begin to rebel against the authorities everywhere, and each person will start demanding all the good things of life, there will be no security agents to protect anyone because the so called security agents are also humans who wants to live their life to the fullest!
Think of this thoroughly, my own religion is the most vilified of all because we are all subjects of our religion and we're the one and only global family of peace loving worshipers today!
@ The Intruder
"we're the one and only global family of peace loving worshipers today!"
I suggest you read some history, because millions and millions of people have been killed in wars started by religion. For example, Cromwell and the Crusades.
Your statement is in direct opposition to reality.
I don't think it is possible to eradicate stupidity.
Uh... You know the UN is mostly controlled by the USA right? The same USA that had a black president, almost had a female president (won the popular vote by over 2 million votes,) but have yet to see an atheist even be considered to be accepted by eithir major party to run for president?
We are so far away from any sort of major position of power being held by someone that is openly atheist I do not expect to see an atheist president for US or any other major office of power within the next half century.
Your religion wants to vilify atheist because of the threat they pose, not to actually hold any offices of power, but that the atheist position, (not a theist,) is so dangerous because ultimately no religion has any sort of actual reasonable counter or response to that position. It strips away the "absolute" authority that religions force onto their followers for total unquestioning loyalty and compliance. Why do you think you theist fear atheist more then islamic extremism that has real world impact and those people are all too happy to kill you for what you believe?
@ The Intruder
1. "My own religion is the most vilified on this planet, so we don't oppose freedom of worship."
As Christianity currently enjoys an unequalled social, political and financial power over any other religion in all the developed nations of the world, and given that Christian churches have a long history of supporting dictatorships to maintain the status quo in many countries, it could well be argued that the vilification comes as thoroughly justified criticism.
No Abrahamic religion unequivocally or unreserevedly supports the freedom of worship of others, and as you failed to mention, they can also be especially intolerant of the non-worshipping atheists.
2. "The Bible said for a short while they will experience relative peace but suddenly the people under them will begin to rebel against the authorities everywhere..."
The bible may well have something like said this, do you have a reference?
In any case, it may as well have also said 'water is wet'. This is not soley a prophecy of insurrection against Christianity, its a recurring political situation that has occurred countless times throughout history beginning long before this particular piece was written. Nothing new here.
Tyranny and rebellion have long been features of human activity and in all cases the rebellion of the oppressed has been reasonably justified.
Volatile social circumstances can lead to situations where "each person will start demanding all the good things of life", Do you mean "good things" such as individual rights and freedom from persecution and discrimination, adequate income, food, housing, health services and safe working conditions perhaps? Most rebellions don't just happen in a vacuum.
Do you have a bible reference for the words 'security agents' ? You mean security agents like the Stasi of East Germany, or the CIA, or those of Mossad? Maybe the Spanish Inquisition, whom nobody expects?
3. If one follows the claims of the New Testament there is no proof that there are any Christians in the world today at all. Where are the miraculous deeds that Yeshua promised his followers could perform with faith in his name to bring glory to his god? The healing, the resurrections, the bringing of rain etc.
The only healing I have witnessed has involved medical science.
There have been no resurrections.
The only rainmaking has been a result of seeding certain clouds with silver iodide (discovered by Bernard Vonnegut, brother to sci-fi writer Kurt).
Where is all this Christian love? I refer you to my other post about how Christian world dominance would prevent the earth becoming hell. Surely there would be oasis of peace and harmony somewhere in the world that we could aspire to, given the numbers of those who follow the Way?
I think what you mean is that you think of Christians as a family of peace loving worshippers who just want to be left alone, while invoking the right to invade everyone else's life to proselytise and preach, like you do right here on the AR hence the "The Intruder". Yeah?
Did that fool really claim Christianity is persecuted or did I misread? If so, I guess we read very different history books However,. I CAN provide three instances where Christians felt hard done by. See below*** The only times of ongoing systematic persecution of which I'm aware have been sectarian , mainly Catholics agains protestants, from Henry V111 to late twentieth century northern Ireland..
Bernadette Soubirous had her visions of a lady**** at Lourdes, between 11 February -16 July 1858. Since that time literally millions of pilgrims have visited Lourdes hoping for a cure. So far, the catholic church has officially recognised a total of 65 cures. Neither at Lourdes or anywhere else have there been reports of miracles involving the regrowth of missing body parts EG eyes into empty sockets, amputated limbs, breasts due cancer, missing testicles due to cancer or accident , that kind of thing. No doubt apologist sophists have a tortuous explanation. The evangelicals an idiot simple one ,as is usually the case when they are called upon to engage in abstract thought.
Oh ,in comparison, the rate of spontaneous remission of disease is 1: 30,000.
***some years ago there was a news report of a group of Mormon missionaries in Thailand. Seems they thought it would be a spiffy idea to have their photos taken sitting on a large statue of the reclining Buddha. They were all arrested for sacrilege . More recently there was an evangelical missionary who went to a forbidden island, in Indonesia, I think. The people there are still tribal. It is illegal to go there. This young man went there to convert the natives. Immediately upon landing, he met martyrdom or won a Darwin award, depending on one's point of view.
However, it IS true that christian were persecuted under the Shogun Togugawa Ieyasu (crucified in fact) in 17th century Japan.
It should be noted that Japan at that time was a sophisticated civilisation with its own unique mixture of Buddhism and Shinto. The Christian missionaries were not invited, yet set about converting the locals with the same arrogance and ignorance which has always been a feature if christian missionaries. Yet still would they have remained tolerated had they not become involved in politics.
****the local bishop reported that Bernadette had TOLD HIM that when she had asked the lady her name, the lady replied, to that illiterate peasant girl, "I am the immaculate conception" . It did not occur to anyone to actually ask Bernadette, because as we all know, bishops never lie. ..... Conveniently, in only 1854, Pope Pius IX, speaking ex cathedra, and therefore infallibly, (literally, from the chair [of St Peter]) had declared the immaculate conception of Mary to be dogma. In this context ,the term 'immaculate conception" means conceived without original sin. The only other person so blessed was of course Jesus.
Being reared in the Irish Catholic tradition, I can tell you the Marian cult was very powerful while I was growing up. Makes sense, it provides a previously absent female goddess to christianity. Has until recently always been especially strong in Ireland. There are shrines and grottos to Mary all over Ireland. Usually sites traditionally sacred to the earth mother.
My reference "Alone of All Her Sex: The Myth and the Cult of the Virgin Mary" Marina Warner, (1976)., "A provocative study of Roman Catholic veneration of the Virgin Mary"
Marina Warner is an excellent and highly respected historian. Her book" Joan of Arc: The Image of Female Heroism" is a corker.
@Tin Man, For your information, i'm in my fifties!
But i have been to so many countries around the world, and i know that without religion the earth wil be a total mess!
What we all need to do is make a thorough research to identify the religion that's working out what is fine, but to say we should scrap it totally, hmmmmmmmm i'm telling you we will all regret it!
I only gave you two examples before, have you thought deeply why someone poor (police) will carry weapons to protect the rich while himself and his family need the money?
My friend, the earth will become a hell if there is nothing giving them a hope or promise of a better life here or elsewhere, there will be no more patience anywhere, everyone will become desperate and nothing can stop them from going for what they want!
@ The Intruder
"But i have been to so many countries around the world, and i know that without religion the earth wil be a total mess!"
Then you obviously have not visited predominately atheist nations such as Finland and Japan, where the crime rate is very low.
Then you have not visited Brazil, where religion is powerful, and so is violent crime.
Then you have not compared atheist versus theistic areas with crime. FYI, heavily religious nations or regions are the worst concerning crime, rape, and ignorance.
No religion on earth, ahh.. what a wonderful thought, I personally think that would be a big step closer to a better life on earth for all people.
Pretty easy to find data that backs this thought too. Simply measure religious following intensity for a geographical area compared to over all health and wellbeing out comes for that area.
Middle east pops out as an extreme example of fervent religious following and lower quality of life outcomes... Where the more secular places, like Japan, northeast europe, New Zealand etc. having much better rates of quality of life for the masses.
"But i have been to so many countries around the world, and i know that without religion the earth will be a total mess!"
As it turns out,I've also visited a few countries, exactly 20 by my count, a bit under 10% of all the countries on earth. Lived in one too. (Muslim Malaysia. As result I do not dislike nor fear Muslims, individually, or as a group) I'm sure nothing to the extent of your travels and experience.
Your claim is demonstrably untrue. Somebody mentioned Japan.Yep, been there ,a very secular country, with very low crime rates, with one of the lowest rates of gun deaths in the world. Same goes for my country, Australia, which is one of the most secularised countries on earth.
Place I have felt unsafe while travelling; Manhattan ,US. The Philippines is described as a catholic country, yet the cities are not safe . They also have has a thriving riving sex tourist industry, including child brothels. The Philippines also has one of the most corrupt political systems in the world. Far worse than the US which I think has the most corrupt political system in the developed world. (No? : Donald Trump's acquittal. ).
The safest I have ever felt travelling? Atheist China. Of course, they shoot thieves and corrupt politicians.
Your claim implies that there can be no morality a without religion. Also demonstrably untrue. Perhaps start with the Greek philosophers .Or have a look the philosophy of Master Kung , (Confucius) which can be both a religion and a form humanism . Or perhaps the teachings of Siddhartha Gautama , called "The Buddha" (enlightened one) His teachings have been interpreted as both an atheistic philosophy and a religion.
The above information is easy to come by on line and at any public library (with the possible exception of US bible belt)
Christians of all sects are so purblind ignorant and full of hubris that they are unable to even consider the possibility of learning from other faiths.,insisting they have access to unique, absolute truths. Unfortunately, in 2000 years , christians have never managed to prove any such thing. Basing their religion on blind faith in unsupported claims, they then have the arrogance to insist everyone else believe as they believe. Of the Abrahamic religions only the Jews the good manners not to proselytise. (IE although they accept converts, they do not seek them)
Intruder: In your own case, if tomorrow you learn there is no god, Will you start killing, stealing and raping?
@Blessed Intruder Re: "For your information, i'm in my fifties!"
...*cringing*... *sucking air through teeth*... Duh-oh!... Ouch. You poor thing. Bless your little heart... *shaking head sadly*... Wow, dude, IF what you say is true, I am amazed you were actually willing to admit it in public. Because at this point, you would have been better off with everybody thinking you are a juvenile who doesn't know any better. Although, to be completely honest, I have my doubts about your proclaimed age. Not that it really matters, though. Even with the language/translation complications put aside (guessing English is not your primary language), you have clearly demonstrated you are here only for the sole purpose of stirring up bullshit in a very childish manner. Lucky for you, though, that is an area in which I excell. Basically, guys like you are simply a delightful form of cheap entertainment for me... *chuckle*... So, please, by all means, continue slinging your nonsense about in your wanton manner until you slip up enough to get booted. I welcome the amusing distraction... *mischievous grin*...
Re: "...have you thought deeply why someone poor (police) will carry weapons to protect the rich while himself and his family need the money?"
... *addressing forum regulars*... Show of hands, please. Who all would like for me to educate this little fella about the police? Or would it even be worth the effort?... *chuckle*...
*Pours Tin-Man his favorite drink and hands it to him*
It will fly right over this guys head, and be lost on him, but tell it anyways maybe add some scantly clad chicks and big explosions, for the slow parts, but I want to hear this.
My country Australia is currently governed by a devout Pentecostal Christian by the name of Scott Morrison.
When he was immigration minister he enacted and continues to support the most racist, inhuman and illegal treatment of genuine refugees, ignoring their legal status and treating them as criminals, when they have done nothing more than plead for asylum.
For many years his government, most of whom claim to be Christian, has supported indefinite detention in prison camps on remote islands off the northern coast without proper housing or health facilities in direct contravention of UN Refugee provisions to which this nation was a signatory.
The lack of hope, the sense of abandonment these people have suffered is evident in the prevalent numbers of suicides and deaths through lack of medical attention. Children have been born and grown up in these gulags; they display profound psychological problems.
You suggest that without Christian dominionism the earth will become a hell.
Your fellow Christians and theists have already achieved that goal, right now, right here in Australia.
And I have not yet even mentioned the draconian policies directed against the poor, the unemployed, the sick, the handicapped and against political and religious opponents that this so-called Christian government has and continues to attempt to legislate.
And I could detail the atrocities of the North Korean theocracy or the barbarous and unjust punishments metered out by those countries who support Sharia Law or basic Koranic teachings, who enforce beheadings, mutilations for transgressions against the Koran. The recent Turkish legislation forcing female victims to marry their rapists in accordance with the wisdom of Allah, is a serious retrograde slide away from the free secular society envisioned by Attaurk.
In the meantime, in neighbouring New Zealand, the current atheist non-racist, humane, Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern, known world-wide for her earnest sympathy and support for victims of recent white supremacist mosque murders, has offered to take all the refugees, regardless of colour or creed, currently interned illegally by the Morrison government of Australia to live as citizens in her country and yet the Morrison government continues to refuse to let them go.
Your risible comments on Christian political benevolence and the inherent evil of atheists, like most of your comments on everything else, are also uninformed, negative, egocentric, and reflect the sort of theism that was popular in the latter Dark Ages.
Your sanctimonious ignorant piety is in tatters.
edited after reflection
To me it almost sounds like you are saying:
Whether religion is all bullshit or not, that you think most people need religion, or it would be chaos. That the poor people with the gun would rob the rich instead of working for them as a guard.
Or basically: religion is useful for controlling the masses.
@ The Intruder:
You said: "My friend, the earth will become a hell if there is nothing giving them a hope or promise of a better life here or elsewhere."
The Earth is hell, just look around, and nothing is giving anyone hope or a promise of a better life, here or elsewhere. This is not the sort of place an God would create. THAT'S WHAT WE ARE FUCKING POINTING OUT!!
Thanks for playing the game, try again tomorrow.
At most, the atheists will abolish "Special Status" for religions. I would love to see the Churches begin to pay their fair share. Treating them like every other non-prophet in the country is the right thing to do. Atheists will not abolish religion because they value freedom of speech too much. Your freedom of speech is also our freedom of speech. You have the freedom to spout your nonsense and we have the freedom to call "BULLSHIT" each and every time you try. Where you see the problem is with the fact that more and more people are starting to listen to us. Religion does not need to be legislated into non-existence, it just needs to go away; It needs to go away like every religion before it.
Whenever I see the agreeable sentiments such as yours expressed, I am put in mind of the religions of ancient Egypt, especially the cult of Amun. At one time the cult was richer than the pharaoh. The history of Egyptian religion can be traced back to 3000 bce, at least.
I have a similar mental reaction when anyone speaks of our present economical and political systems as if they are a matter of natural law and so will last forever. Just as individual human life is very temporary, so too are all of our works.
It bemuses me that people tend to think Shelley's poem Ozymandias is only about Ramses the great.:
I met a traveller from an antique land,
Who said—“Two vast and trunkless legs of stone
Stand in the desert. . . . Near them, on the sand,
Half sunk a shattered visage lies, whose frown,
And wrinkled lip, and sneer of cold command,
Tell that its sculptor well those passions read
Which yet survive, stamped on these lifeless things,
The hand that mocked them, and the heart that fed;
And on the pedestal, these words appear:
My name is Ozymandias, King of Kings;
Look on my Works, ye Mighty, and despair!
Nothing beside remains. Round the decay
Of that colossal Wreck, boundless and bare
The lone and level sands stretch far away.”
In contrast ,Horace Smith's "Ozymandias" is about as subtle as an enema.
In Egypt's sandy silence, all alone,
Stands a gigantic Leg, which far off throws
The only shadow that the Desert knows:—
"I am great OZYMANDIAS," saith the stone,
"The King of Kings; this mighty City shows
The wonders of my hand."— The City's gone,—
Naught but the Leg remaining to disclose
The site of this forgotten Babylon.
We wonder,—and some Hunter may express
Wonder like ours, when thro' the wilderness
Where London stood, holding the Wolf in chace,
He meets some fragment huge, and stops to guess
What powerful but unrecorded race
Once dwelt in that annihilated place.
I have been on this forum for less than a month and everyone here suddenly thinks they know me
I am one of Jehovah's Witnesses, we don't participate in the political affairs anywhere we are, because we believe that all humans came from one family and we're here to unite the OBEDIENT ones as one big and happy family of peace loving worshipers globally!
For your information ATHEISM is no match for Jehovah's Witnesses, because your group only depends on COMPARING THEMSELVES WITH RELIGIONISTS TO JUSTIFY YOUR STAND.
With that, Jehovah's Witnesses (the one and only true Christian group) will surely disqualify you with the way and manner we are organized, that's when we will know who becomes intolerant towards the other between your folks and my global family!
Intruder, what do you think of the coverups of sexual assault in your JW organization?
You guys are not getting my point.
You are comparing countries that are less religious to highly religious ones.
Well perhaps i should remind you that people who well fed can only be noticed in the midst of hungry paupers, but in the midst of blind men an eyed man rules.
The countries you're referring to are watching the mistakes of others to organize themselves. And the fact remains that they are trying really hard to avoid the pitfalls of their highly religious counterparts.
What i'm saying is if the whole world should debunk the idea of God/Gods which of course is coming to happen soon, there will be no standards to compare and each person will choose what to do or undo, there is just one single group worshipping the TRUE God globally, this group will remain and they'll become the target of all others who by then would have embraced atheism.
By then you will have to know that all the people around you are comparing their man-made rules for right and wrong with RELIGION!
As for myself, i once considered atheism but i later found out that all what the atheists are banking on is COMPARING THEMSELVES WITH RELIGIONISTS, so i agreed completely with the true Christians and their book (Bible) that when that which standing as the mirror (religion) is destroyed the earth will surely become a total mess in the hands of atheists!
For the main time continue to meditate on all the things atheists are saying and if you are truly sincere, ask yourself "will atheism be able to stand the test of time the same way religion did over thousands of years?"
@Master Intruder-san Re: "You guys are not getting my point."
Oh, don't worry. Rest assured we are definitely getting your "point". Problem, though, is your "point" is about as sharp as a pound of warm chicken livers.... *sudden look of realization*... Hmmm... Speaking of chicken livers, I'm getting hungry... *scampering off toward kitchen*...
Intruder: re: By then you will have to know that all the people around you are comparing their man-made rules for right and wrong with RELIGION!
DON'T BE A FUCKTARD. ALL RELIGIONS ARE MAN MADE. Religions "ARE" man made rules.
@Nyarlathotep, well that cartoon depicts the misinformed churchgoers spewing their gibberish in our neighborhood, NOT Christians!
The Watch Tower Society (Jehovah's Witnesses) has a history of setting dates for the end of times; then having the dates pass without it happening.
You are about as much JW as I am Mohican. Muppet.
@Old Man shouts, There you go again!
If it's about the way i insulted you at first, then i tender an apology.
Right now, I'm not asking you to come and worship my God, all i'm saying is Jehovah's Witnesses (true Christians) are totally different from those noisemakers saying all sort of gibberish in your streets and public buses, we approach you and accord you due respect, discuss freely with you to know your thoughts on issues and find a way to start relating as neighbours that's all.
It's when you see the benefits of what we are doing that you'll decide whether to join our global family or remain just a friend.
That's what tolerance is all about!
@Intruder Extraordinaire Re: JW's
So, you are JW, huh? Fascinating... You mean they have JW's in and around India? (Just speculating you are from that general region because of your writing characteristics. Of course, I could be totally wrong. I've been wrong before. It happens.) Anyway, that aside...
It might interest you to know I just had a very pleasant meeting with a couple of your brethren today. Yep, we spent almost three hours here in my living room discussing various aspects of creation and your god's perfection. Oddly enough, unlike you, the two gentlemen who arrived were very mature, polite, and engaging. I thoroughly enjoyed our conversation, and it is very likely they will return in the near future to continue our discussion. Hmmmm... Perhaps you should pay a visit to your nearest Kingdom Hall and brush up a bit on your people skills... *chuckle*...
@Tin Man, Once you've seen them, then you don't need chatting with me sir, i'm just a piece of rubbish without them.
So don't bother responding to stupid ol' me, you've met my family members, continue discussing with my teachers!