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Cognostic's picture
@Joshb: That is exactly

@Joshb: That is exactly what David is talking about. The good faithful, god fearing, Nazis. Not only Hitler but all the Nazis who take the Oath.

David Killens's picture


Hitler was a christian who had faith. By your recent disclosure, he is in heaven

Anne Frank was a jew, and thus this innocent victim of brutality is in hell.


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NewSkeptic's picture
[Verse 1]

As all can see, you don't need faith. Just never be a sinner and Jesus will be your friend.

When I die and they lay me to rest
Gonna go to the place that's the best
When I lay me down to die
Goin' up to the spirit in the sky
Goin' up to the spirit in the sky
That's where I'm gonna go when I die
When I die and they lay me to rest
Gonna go to the place that's the best

Prepare yourself you know it's a must
Gotta have a friend in Jesus
So you know that when you die
He's gonna recommend you
To the spirit in the sky
Gonna recommend you
To the spirit in the sky
That's where you're gonna go when you die
When you die and they lay you to rest
You're gonna go to the place that's the best

Never been a sinner I never sinned
I got a friend in Jesus
So you know that when I die
He's gonna set me up with
The spirit in the sky
Oh set me up with the spirit in the sky
That's where I'm gonna go when I die
When I die and they lay me to rest
I'm gonna go to the place that's the best
Go to the place that's the best

Grinseed's picture

deleted, slightly off topic, just a morning rant

boomer47's picture


Christians often seem to need a sense of purpose to their lives. Imo that is one of the reasons humans invented religion.

My position is that the purpose of life is itself. By that I mean the continuance of life in every form . This has nothing to do with individual ego .

Individually, I matter most to myself . It is my responsibility to find purpose for my life . At 72 , my purpose begins with waking up each day. I am deeply appreciative of simply living . I have no need for some vague, heroic purpose. (such as converting others to my beliefs ,or lack of them.

Tin-Man's picture
@Josh Re: " I am interested

@Josh Re: " I am interested in hearing about where atheists find their purpose in life in a godless world. Where/ how do you find purpose? What does this life mean, if anything? If it doesnt, why endure suffering?"

(Before reading other responses.)

Wow.... Gee... Where to start?... *hanging head and shaking sadly*... I tell ya, man, finding purpose in life is tough now, no doubt. Once we atheists finally made the decision to choose not to believe in your god, we had to change our entire world view. Yep, life just ain't what it use to be... *heavy sigh*... For instance, when I still chose to believe in god, I always had the safety net of knowing no matter how horrible a person I was, I could always ask god for forgiveness and my slate would be wiped clean. For I had been baptized and was saved and my place in heaven was assured beyond a shadow of a doubt. Therefore, my purpose in life at the time was to simply do whatever I ever wanted to do to please ME, regardless of how badly it might have affected others. Because - hey - why not, right? After all, I would still be going to heaven after I died, and all would be well. Easy-peasy. And if I happened to hurt anybody along the way, that was their problem, not mine. They had access to the same god I did, so it was up to them to reconcile their problems with god. Matter of fact, they could even pray to god to ask him to forgive me. Win-win! Ahhhh, yeah, those were the days... *dreamy look*... I could be as reckless as I wanted and take absolutely no responsibility for my actions. Either "the devil made me do it", in which case I asked god to forgive me. Or, "I felt it in my heart" that god was telling me to do the things I was doing, because it was obviously part of god's perfect plan. Yes, sir, my life was FULL of purpose! Mostly, it was centered around having fun no matter what. Yeeeeee-haaaaaaa! You can't touch me! I've got GOD on my side!

Nowadays, however, it's a whole different story... *shaking head sadly*... Yep, ever since the day I chose to no longer believe in god, I quickly realized that I no longer had that safety net of total forgiveness. I could no longer blame my bad behavior on the mean ol' nasty Devil. I could no longer tell people I had a "vision from god" to justify my questionable actions. Worst of all, though, it meant I had to grow the fuck up and start taking personal responsibility for the things I do... *shudder*... As a result, my purpose in life ended up changing completely. My days are now primarily spent loving my wife and helping her take care of the house and our property. Washing clothes, helping cook meals, washing dishes, helping clean the house, cutting grass, doing odd-n-end maintenance tasks, yadda-yadda-yadda. Oh, and along with all of THAT nonsense, I spend a great deal of time taking care of my disabled Uncle, by transporting him back and forth to all of his medical appointments, cutting his grass, assisting him with his finances and medications, and so forth. As if that wasn't enough, in my spare time during the evenings when my wife is at work, I end up spending a majority of my time in my basement workshop and/or in my sewing room where I design/build/fabricate a variety of woodwork, leather, and fabric items as gifts for friends and family for Christmas and birthdays and such. Basically, I now have to treat other people with kindness, dignity, and respect, because it is now ME who has to take full responsibility for my behavior/actions. And the real pisser of it all is that I actually ENJOY doing all of those things most of the time! WHAT THE HELL???... *rolling eyes*... Can you believe that shit?

So, yeah, as you can see, finding purpose in life now as an atheist is a real struggle. It's a wonder I even decide to get out of bed every morning. I swear, life was so much easier when I could just say, "Fuck it. God will forgive me no matter what I do." Nevertheless, I somehow endure all the suffering and misery caused by my choice to be an atheist. Life goes on...

(Now to go read other replies.)

Edit to add: Oh, for the sake of clarity, before anybody gets their feathers ruffled, the remarks I made such as, "Once we atheists finally made the decision to choose not to believe in your god," are dripping with sarcasm... *chuckle*... Just wanted to make that clear before Cog starts flinging poo at me.

MTheory's picture


Several months ago you posted this on another thread. It's my favorite! Thought Josh may enjoy it as well.

Things I do not believe but are not limited to:

1. The creation of the Universe. Not only that, but a magical sky being existing beyond space and time that isn't contradictory, being responsible for doing the creating.

2. Magical flying sky beings impregnating virgins and making magical babies that are really the same God that impregnated the virgin in the first place.

3. Dead people crawling up out of the ground and then walking around and convincing people they are alive and well.

4. Praying to a magical man in the sky can change the course of the seas, cure disease, ease pain, stop suffering and the person praying for a better life.

5. A magical afterlife where believers meet their loved ones once again and everyone will be spiritually alive and happy together not like they are in real life on this planet.

6. Unconditional love is unconditional as long as you believe, open your heart, submit and never engage in blasphemy or apostasy. (Side note: Babies who do not have water sprinkled over their heads burn in hell too.)

7. Something called a spirit resides within the human body and is eternal, so that even after death theists get to keep on being narrow minded. I believe they get to die just like the rest of us.

8. The idea that ritualistic cannibalism and blood sacrifice in remembernce of the flying sky being that involve imbibing grape juice and wine that can magically be turned into actual blood or eating bread that transubstantes into real living flesh in a believers tummy is reasonably sane.

9. The creator God thing inspired the writing of a non-contradictory holy book that only appears to be full of contradictions that aren't really contradictions if theists make up enough excuses to resolve them.

10. The magical-Jesus man thing, the son of a virgin impregnated by the flying sky God, who is actually the flying sky God himself in baby form, and who is also something called a Holy Ghost, is worshipped because the original God could think of no other way to bring forgiveness to mankind than to kill himself in a blood sacrifice while he pretended to be his own son.

11. Evil magical demons can take hold of your mind and force you to do terrible things if you are not protected by the good and kind magical flying sky daddy.

12. The idea that Jesus had the power to spit in the eye of a blind person and cure them of their blindness. People can fly, serpents and asses can talk, water can be changed into wine and fish and bread can be magically multiplied to make more.

*Quote from Harvard Divinity's Religious Literacy Project ~ Traditions Often Blind Us From The Truth


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Cognostic's picture
@MTheory: HOLY SHIT!!!

@MTheory: HOLY SHIT!!! Yep, that looks like something I would write.
Someone actually read something I wrote!!!! Now I know what it feels like to be Cali.

(Edit: Wow that was a rough read. I must have been in a hurry that day. Nothing like Cali at all. I could have taken a bit more time working on some of those sentences. )
Wait wait wait..... now I am off topic. Can we please get back to this moral bullshit Joshb is asserting. Sorry Joshb, I meant to say HORSESHIT!
EDIT: That was written so poorly that I had to do a re-write and save it to my desktop. I will use the mended version at some point in the future. I thought the idea was good but the presentation was horrible. I have a better version now.

Randomhero1982's picture
Perhaps an outside view of

Perhaps an outside view of human purpose may be to propagate the species and die, like all life.

However, its certainly possible for one to have their own self purpose.

boomer47's picture


"Ephesians 2:8-9 "For by grace you have been saved by faith and that not of yourselves it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast."

Catholic view:

"James 2:14-26 New Life Version (NLV)
Faith Without Works Is Dead

14 My Christian brothers, what good does it do if you say you have faith but do not do things that prove you have faith? Can that kind of faith save you from the punishment of sin? 15 What if a Christian does not have clothes or food? 16 And one of you says to him, “Goodbye, keep yourself warm and eat well.” But if you do not give him what he needs, how does that help him? 17 A faith that does not do things is a dead faith.

18 Someone may say, “You have faith, and I do things. Prove to me you have faith when you are doing nothing. I will prove to you I have faith by doing things.” 19 You believe there is one God. That is good! But even the demons believe that, and because they do, they shake.

20 You foolish man! Do I have to prove to you that faith without doing things is of no use? 21 Was not our early father Abraham right with God by what he did? He obeyed God and put his son Isaac on the altar to die. 22 You see his faith working by what he did and his faith was made perfect by what he did. 23 It happened as the Holy Writings said it would happen. They say, “Abraham put his trust in God and he became right with God.” He was called the friend of God. 24 A man becomes right with God by what he does and not by faith only. 25 The same was true with Rahab, the woman who sold the use of her body. She became right with God by what she did in helping the men who had been sent to look through the country and sent them away by another road. 26 The body is dead when there is no spirit in it. It is the same with faith. Faith is dead when nothing is done."

Scripture is so contradictory and/ vague/, impenetrable ( IE Revelations) that one can find justification for literally any position.

As with holy books generally, the Christian canon is myth; .proves exactly nothing .

Sheldon's picture


How does the obvious absence of an overarching purpose to the lives of just one species of evolved ape, remotely evidence the existence of a deity from a bronze age superstition?

Ding ding ding ding****loaded straw man fallacy alert****ding ding ding...

Joshb's picture
@ Sheldon

@ Sheldon

First off my intention was never to "prove" God through the idea of purposes. I was just wondering where you all find purpose in your lives.

Second I personally struggle to find purpose without God in my life which is why I ask the question. I find it hard to find true purpose in earthly things without a deity. Like whats the point?

Tin-Man's picture
@Josh Re: "I find it hard to

@Josh Re: "I find it hard to find true purpose in earthly things without a deity. Like whats the point?"

Ouch... *cringe*... Dang... So sad. Dude, if that statement you made is actually how you truly feel, then I truly and sincerely feel sorry for you.

Cognostic's picture
@Josh: Your struggle to

@Josh: Your struggle to get out of bed in the morning is not interesting. Perhaps if you gave up your imaginary purpose and actually went after something real, you could feel proud of your accomplishment.

imaginary friend = imaginary struggle

CyberLN's picture
@OP, I’ve given some thought

@OP, I’ve given some thought to this whole ‘purpose’ thing. I spent time trying to pinpoint mine. Turns out, I haven’t any. I’ve things I enjoy, people I love, dreams, so many thing I could list here. But as I reviewed them, they didn’t seem to fit the bill of being some celestial purpose.

And that’s ok. I have no need of any purpose akin to what theists consider it to be. I’m wholly satisfied with my life, and although I’ve some struggles with which to contend, living beats the alternative right now.

I guess I just don’t understand the need for some “purpose”...I choose to continue living because I like it, not because I’m driven to fulfill any hierarchical purpose.

Cognostic's picture
@Cyber: Then your purpose

@Cyber: Then your purpose is very near my own. (YOU ARE WHAT YOU DO.) Your purpose is to not understand the need for purpose and to enjoy life because you like it.

My creed has always been, "If you are not enjoying your life, you are living it wrong." My purpose has always been to find a way to enjoy my life. Hedonistic? Perhaps. But if I am happy in all I do, the people around me sure seem to perk up and enjoy their lives a bit more when I am around. "Life is short! Live it! "

CyberLN's picture
Well, Cog, I’ve always

Well, Cog, I’ve always considered that the meaning of life is living. As to hedonism, there are times in life (at least in mine) that are not at all pleasant. That’s part of the package. The value I find in being alive simply outweighs the things that are fucked up. I’ve learned how not to let the little times fly away, though. Sitting at a sunny window with the cat in my lap can be most pleasing.

Old man shouts at clouds's picture
@ CyberLN

@ CyberLN

"Sitting at a sunny window with the cat in my lap can be most pleasing."

I am pretty sure that my Mau thinks that is my entire purpose in life, apart from the 11am brushing, the 5pm feeding and walking the bounds at 9pm.

Yeh, I am ok with that as my purpose in life.

Sheldon's picture
Cyber "although I’ve some

Cyber "although I’ve some struggles with which to contend, living beats the alternative right now."

This is a very good point. I feel the same way, and firstly I'll point out that there are people suffering in ways I can't begin to imagine. However, I am speaking as someone for whom almost the entire focus of my plans and hopes were stripped away in an instant recently through separation and divorce. I now find myself in a position where at 54 I have to completely reinvent what the rest of my life will be.

Like Cyber though, I fail to see how this requires a delusional belief that the entire universe, and everything in it, was created with a predetermined purpose for me.

That's just too absurd and egotistical. I owe it to myself and those who care about my wellbeing to live the best life I can, whatever it will be. Its surprising how resilient and malleable the human mind can be, if we give it a chance, and we only have to look at some of the awful tragedies people endure for confirmation of this.

Let's not forget, if Josh were right, his deities PLAN involved mass predation and unimaginable suffering over hundreds of millions of years, before the first human evolved. That's some PLAN, and from an omniscient omnipotent deity as well, it would ipso facto be cruel and sadistic almost beyond our imagining. I'd want no part of any such deity, even were the nonsensical superstitious myths about it true.

Cognostic's picture
@Cyber: So very close! I

@Cyber: So very close! I don't worry about the scales but accept things I don't like happen. My question is always, "what did I learn?" and move on from there. You also mention "learn." and letting things fly away (moving on). On a sunny day the cat's fur is warm and the sunlight will sparkle off of each tiny hair. On a rainy day the cat is warm in your lap and the drops on the window play a game of chase as they race to the bottom. I hope I have a hot cup of coffee by my side and a good book as well.


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