QUESTIONS AJ777 refuses to answer.

134 posts / 0 new

Sat, 01/26/2019 - 07:04

(Reply to #91) #92

arakish

@ Empedocles

The Set Of Atheist Beliefs

1. There are no gods.
2. Science and technology are the only answers to mankind's problems.
3. Evolution.
4. The earth is spherical.
5. The Bible is mythology.

Nyarlathotep, can we also get a set of Disagree buttons in the 100, 1k, 10k ranges? ;-P

Oh how wrong you are.

False
False
False
False
False

There is only ONE thing that is common amongst all atheists: "Lack of belief in any gods." There is nothing else in common with atheists. I know atheists who also do not believe the Earth is a spheroid.

Kind sir, please do some actual critical thinking, logical and deductive reasoning, and rational and analytical thought, before you start flinging baseless and fallacious and inane and asinine assertions.

rmfr

Sat, 01/26/2019 - 12:43

(Reply to #92) #93

Empedocles

@arakish

There is only ONE thing that is common amongst all atheists: "Lack of belief in any gods." There is nothing else in common with atheists. I know atheists who also do not believe the Earth is a spheroid.

Kind sir, please do some actual critical thinking, logical and deductive reasoning, and rational and analytical thought, before you start flinging baseless and fallacious and inane and asinine assertions.

Only one, huh? That is funny because you say critical thinking, logical and deductive reasoning and blah, blah, blah. Only one thing. What about you were born on Earth? You have blood flowing through your veins? You breath?

Sat, 01/26/2019 - 13:01

(Reply to #93) #94

gupsphoo

Empedocles, yes, a non

Empedocles, yes, a non-thinking non-reasoning illogical person who was born on Mars and somehow has no blood flow would be an atheist, as long as he/she does not believe in god(s).

Sat, 01/26/2019 - 13:10

(Reply to #94) #95

Empedocles

@CHK-C

Yes, but you wouldn't have the two additional things I mentioned in common.

Sun, 01/27/2019 - 02:08

(Reply to #95) #96

arakish

Empedocles: "What about you

Empedocles: "What about you were born on Earth? You have blood flowing through your veins? You breath?"

Unfortunately, these are facts I am forced to share with Religious Absolutists.

There may be more than ONE thing common amongst atheists, but the the only true commonality amongst atheist is “a lack of belief in any deities.” Furthermore, that definition could be refined to “a lack of belief in claims any deities exist.”

One good example of another "belief" (lack of better word) amongst a large number of atheist is the belief that the Theory of Evolution is FACTS (Formulated Accurately Codified Truth in Science).

Reiteration: There is only one true commonality amongst atheists. “A lack of belief in claims any deities exist.”

And until you Religious Absolutists can provide irrefutable OBJECTIVE HARD EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE that any deity exists, your preposterous claims shall be summarily dismissed.

Onus probandi incumbit ei qui dicit non ei qui negat.

rmfr

Sun, 01/27/2019 - 10:07

(Reply to #96) #97

Empedocles

@arakish

And until you Religious Absolutists can provide irrefutable OBJECTIVE HARD EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE that any deity exists, your preposterous claims shall be summarily dismissed.

Onus probandi incumbit ei qui dicit non ei qui negat.

You think it's my responsibility to do that? No wonder you have no idea of what you criticize, you wait around for someone else to bear the burden and then have no choice but to dismiss it out of complete ignorance.

Doesn't sound very scientific to me and it sure as hell don't make for much of a debate.

I bet you're an independent thinker, aren't you? Independent of thought.

Sun, 01/27/2019 - 13:56

(Reply to #97) #98

arakish

@ Empedocles

I'll keep this short since I have written books about this.

“You think it's my responsibility to do that? (Provide OBJECTIVE HARD EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE.)”

Yes it is your responsibility. Onus probandi incumbit ei qui dicit non ei qui negat. Latin for "He who says he does not have the burden of proof lies."

You are the one asserting preposterous claims of a deity without any proof (OBJECTIVE HARD EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE). The burden is on you to back up your claims, or admit you cannot and are wrong.

“No wonder you have no idea of what you criticize, you wait around for someone else to bear the burden and then have no choice but to dismiss it out of complete ignorance.”

Oh, I know what I criticize. I have studied religion, many different religions, for over 50 years. Probably longer than you have been alive. However, my particular expertise is the Noahacian Flood Myth and The Exodus That Went Nowhere. Perhaps the two greatest lynchpins in the Judeo-Christian beliefs systems. Discovering through the decades of research I have done, and actually traveling all around the region of the Levant and Mediterranean in the attempt to prove these two stories correct, I only discovered they are stories plagiarized and re-written from sources FAR! older than the Bible. Many of those sources/stories are thousands of years older than the Bible and the Hebrew people themselves.

Did you know that the Hebrews did not come into existence until around 900 BCE? Five hundred years after the events that supposedly occurred in the book of Exodus (circa 1450 BCE)? Please explain how the Hebrews (later Jews) could have been enslaved in Egypt from circa 1880 BCE to 1450 BCE when the Hebrew people did not exit until around 900 BCE? The dates were derived from many hundreds of biblical scholars agreeing that the Exodus began in 1450 BCE. The beginning date is simply adding the 430 years from Exodus 12:40 "Now the time that the children of Israel lived in Egypt was four hundred thirty years."

“Doesn't sound very scientific to me and it sure as hell don't make for much of a debate.”

Only because you are not a scientist. I am a volcanologist working at the world's largest land-based caldera.

“I bet you're an independent thinker, aren't you? Independent of thought.”

Not independent thinker. Free and Rational Thinker (a FaRT). ;-P

Speaking of “independent of thought,” you seem to be the epitome of such since you fail to do any research into the presupposed assumptive assertions you are making without any evidence.

rmfr

Sun, 01/27/2019 - 07:05

(Reply to #98) #99

Sheldon

"Only one thing. What about

"Only one thing. What about you were born on Earth? You have blood flowing through your veins? You breath?"

He said common among atheists, now ask yourself are those characteristics limited to atheists? Dear oh dear but you really are dumb, and there are three fucking things there genius, good grief.

Sun, 01/27/2019 - 10:02

(Reply to #99) #100

Empedocles

@Sheldon

Are you denying the commonality of the two examples I provided upon request, you vacuous little fuck or did you somehow read exclusive in the response.

Sun, 01/27/2019 - 10:05

(Reply to #100) #101

toto974

@ Sheldon, @Empedocles,

Can we remain civil and not resort to insults?

Sun, 01/27/2019 - 10:12

(Reply to #101) #102

Empedocles

@Talyyn

Yes, of course. My apologies to Sheldon and the forum.

Sun, 01/27/2019 - 10:39

(Reply to #102) #103

Sheldon

Sorry but I can't dumb that

Sorry but I can't dumb that down anymore for you.

You're the one who believes in myths and superstitious magic, that you can't demonstrate a shred of objective evidence for, so you calling anyone vacuous is pretty ironic. Maybe you would benefit from anger management therapy, you seem pretty tightly wound.

Sat, 01/26/2019 - 12:11

(Reply to #103) #104

Sky Pilot

Empedocles,

The 257th Set of Theist Beliefs

1. There are thousands of Gods and billions of demons.
2. Magic and witchcraft are the best answers to mankind's problems.
3. All life came from golems and ribs.
4. The Earth is a solid equilateral square triangle resting on a turtle.
5. The Bible, Koran, and the Book of Mormon came directly from space aliens.

Mon, 01/21/2019 - 18:19

#105

arakish

@ AJ777

Is it objectively moral to force children to believe in the Bible utilizing mental rape, emotional molestation, and psychological terrorism? Is it objectively moral to force a belief in an entity that cannot be proven by utilizing mental rape, emotional molestation, and psychological terrorism?

Even if your God exists outside of normal space and time, anything it does to this realm will leave evidence. Where is that evidence?

There are approximately 20,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 (20 trillion billions (US)) stars in this universe. We are now discovering that stars with planets are the norm, instead of the exception. We have even discovered several Terran-type planets within what is called the “Goldilocks Zone.” Do you honestly expect me to believe that your God created such a huge universe with all those galaxies and stars and planets just for a single species of backward, primitive, barbaric primates on only one insignificant planet orbiting an insignificant star located in an insignificant galaxy located in an insignificant universe? If you believe such a delusion, then you are truly suffering from the major mental disorders as described here.
- Even if I were to say that only one-hundredth of one-hundredth of one-hundredth of one-hundredth of one-hundredth of one-hundredth of one-hundredth of one-hundredth of one-hundredth of one-hundredth of one percent (×0.000 000 000 000 000 000 01) of those total stars has an “earth-like” planet with intelligent life and an advanced civilization comparable to ours, that would mean that there would still be 200 such planets in this vast universe. Of course, if all 200 were evenly distributed throughout the universe, the distances would be so vast between us, none shall ever know the existence of the others. Ever. Think Critically about it.
From whence comes evil and sin?

Who sends who to Hell?

======================================================================

And do not forgot to address the questions directly posed and implied in this short essay...

There is no philosophical ideology more divisive than religion. Religion does nothing but pervert, demoralize, subvert, and bribe all persons with the belief that it alone possesses the one and only truth. And, the worst part of ANY religion is that it is an ideology that is implicitly and explicitly protected from any and all criticism from both within and without. Why should any ideology, especially religion, be so privileged? Can you not see how disastrous this way of thinking can be, and is?

I know religion is, and has always been, tremendously harmful to Humanity. I know that religions, and their way of thinking, and their theological disagreements, have created the greatest violence, destruction, injury, death, bigotry, harm, immorality, intolerance, wickedness, and abuse to the human species than any other cause. The main problem is not religious fundamentalism, but the fundamentals of religion. Religion’s loose version of “morality,” has NO place in a civilized society.

Sure. You can argue that it is the extremists, not the doctrine. All this says to me is that you have never truly read the various doctrines. It is both. Extremists might be using it as an excuse, but it is an excuse that the religious texts readily provide. I firmly believe, and shall take this belief to my grave, that the human species would have been much better off had there NEVER been ANY form of religion. EVER!

I see NO evidence of ANY gods, but plenty of evidence of religion’s harm.

And I am a lot more concerned with the welfare of my fellow human beings than I am about “offending” or “hurting the feelings” of a bunch of barbarians who choose to believe in the faerie tales of an obsolete, irrelevant, savage, offensive, and unsubstantiated, immoral Bronze and Iron Age religious text about a make-believe imaginative Sky Faerie and Magic Lich Virgin.

Offended? So the fuck what!

Ultimately, it is Religion that is Humankind’s worst enemy.

rmfr

Sat, 01/26/2019 - 02:11

#106

arakish

@ Everyone

Here is a project I finally partially finished. Partially, because I may not have caught all the questions. This is a list of all the questions where AJ777 did a Breezy, constantly refusing to answer. Quite impressive.

This is a list of ALL the Questions, Inquiries, and Requests AJ777 is too afraid to answer because

He does not have an answer and won't admit it, or
He knows the answer and since it refutes his nonsensical diatribes, he won't admit it, or
He already knows his religion is nothing more than a plagiarized anthology of lies and is a Troll.
There may be other reasons I ain't thought of…

All of these questions come from ONLY the thread How can religion be evil? Also, please realize this list is NOT completely exhaustive.

Is it not more important how to think, than to be told what to think?

Is it objectively moral to threaten children with mental rape, emotional molestation, and psychological terrorism of eternal damnation in your Hell (for it is not biblical) and teaching them that they are born evil and sinful due to an evil and sinful act?

If my father just happened to have robbed a bank, is it even conceivable that I, his son, should also be put into prison for his crime? That my children, his grandchildren, should also be put into prison for his crime?

Show me any religion that is moral, for there are none.

Have you even read the Bible? Using critical thinking, logical and deductive reasoning, and rational and analytical thought? Do you even know what critical thinking, logical and deductive reasoning, and rational and analytical thought are? Do you even know how to comprehensively read?

Do you believe the Divine Command Morality is objectively moral?

Provide evidence that no philosophical ideology is not more divisive than religion.

Prove religion does not do nothing but pervert, demoralize, subvert, and bribe all persons with the belief that it possesses the one and only truth.

Prove religion is not an ideology that is implicitly and explicitly protected from any and all criticism from both within and without. Why should any ideology, especially religion, be so privileged? Can you not see how disastrous this way of thinking can be, and is?

Where did you ever get the idea Religion is not evil?

Can you demonstrate objective evidence anything in any religion has an origin that is not entirely human?

Prove religion does not condemn people as an "abomination" because they happen to have been born gay. Insists everyone worship an angry unevidenced deity that it also claims committed genocide. The same deity according to the bible tortured a new born baby to death over 7 days because it was angered it was conceived in an adulterous affair. One wonders what anyone's standard for evil behaviour is if this doesn't fit the description?

Are you saying you don't think acts like genocide, rapine, murder, slavery, homophobia, misogyny, and torture are all immoral and/or evil? The bible condones them all.

Why do so many theists never read dictionaries?

What makes you think morality is not subjective?

Do you think god and religion are the same thing?

Are you going to offer anything substantive to the responses people have made, or were you just wasting everyone's time?

Where do you get off pretending you know something about morality?

Are you claiming you do not know whether murder is wrong unless you're told by a deity?

Do you believe murder is immoral, or do you just desist because you think a deity wants you to?

Do you think morals are objective?

Do you think morals come from your god?

Is there any context in which genocide could be morally justified?

Is there any context in which you think slavery can be morally justified?

Is sending people to eternal damnation and torment morally justifiable due to the simple reason a person chooses not to believe due to absolutely no evidence that your deity exists?

Please, provide OBJECTIVE HARD EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE that your deity even exists.

Why the metaphors in the Bible? Why can they not speak plainly and simply on the issue; why the vagueness? Is it perhaps because humans wrote, edited, translated, printed, copied, plagiarized, and all this ×100 times or more that is vague, or is it because this all powerful "god" idea likes to be vague on the one of the extremely rare times this "god" idea tries to communicate to humans?

If your deity is all-knowing, then why does it only speak one language? Why must your deity rely on fallacious humans to translate its given word? Why could your deity not give its wisdom to all the peoples of the Earth? Why did your deity choose the most primitive peoples as its chosen people when the Chinese were well more advanced in philosophy and technology than a bunch of primitive desert-dwelling goat-herders?

I see good and evil as qualities of certain actions and people relative to their effect on other people. Do you see good as a substance with independent existence; something that can be extracted and removed?

How come your absolute morality is so relativistic?

If Hell is evil, is it not also evil to condemn someone to Hell?

Doesn't the Bible also have a commandment to stone unruly children to death?

Doesn't the Bible also condone slavery and rapine?

If the Bible is objetively moral, then I can get me a new young wife to take care of me in my old age by going down the road and raping my neighbor's 14 year old daughter, pay him the equivalent of 50 shekels of silver (about $200). Deuteronomy 22:28-29: “If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found; then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel’s father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath humbled her, he may not put her away all his days.” How about that for objective morality?

What's wrong with addressing all the answers everyone has given to you already?

Which of the commandments forbids rape or torture?

Which commandment requires parents to protect and cherish their children?

Is the Noah flood a myth?

Are you saying global genocide is not evil?

Is it evil or not to murder Job's entire family and torment him just to win a bet?

Wasn't theology once busy for decades debating how many angels could dance on the head of a pin?

When was the last time you sacrificed a lamb or some turtledoves?

Where is it you think antisemitism comes from exactly?

You know the KKK is a christian organisation right?

That's a bit vague isn't it? Who's my neighbor?

Wouldn't the one true almighty god not be very worried about false idol worship? Why would this "god" idea care so much about that, but not about things like rape and enslavement?

Don't your arms get tired from shoveling so much horseshit?

Is god more concerned about property crimes than crimes against the person, such as rape, torture, and enslavement?

Did it really not occur to Moses, or the Hebrews, not to kill, rape, and steal from each other until they were told by a deity?

Is slavery immoral?

Cite one objective moral value your god does not violate.

Show in your Bible that it is not the big book of god's immoral acts.

“Leviticus 19:18 “love your neighbor as yourself” ” What if you hate yourself? What if you’re a cutter? What if you are a sociopath? What if you are a junkie? What if you are a masochist?

Can you pass the Turing test?

Where do you think the ultimate origins of religion come from?

What reality are you talking about?

Which deity are you talking about?

Which religion/sect/cult are you talking about?

Which religion has a set of beliefs about reality?

What objective evidence can you state that demonstrates human morality requires anything other than human reasoning?

Your god sits and watches as people are raped, murdered, enslaved, molested, and worse; where is the objective morality of that?

What would be the consequence for allowing a child to starve to death while you stood there and watched?

What would be the consequence for allowing people to burn to death in a fire when you could have prevented it?

What would be the consequence for inflicting cancers and all manner of diseases on people?

Are you insane?

So you deny the existence of Allah so you can get stinking drunk every night?

Or do you not believe the claims Islam makes for it's deity?

Just look at the appalling and endemic child rape perpetrated by the Catholic priesthood and explain how being a theist is a check on immoral behaviour?

What is the ultimate source of Evil?

From whence came evil and sin?

Since, according you that ALL things must have a cause, then what was the cause that created your god? And if you think infinite regress is impossible: Mandelbrat Zoom: Edge of Inifinity (but don't watch it is 2½ long).

What is religion other than a schizophrenic delusion?

Are you really claiming that without a deity you wouldn't know that raping and murdering a child was wrong?

Why must you always evade and ignore any answer to your questions? Is it because you know you cannot refute the answers given?

I challenge you to demonstrate what you consider to be the best piece of objective evidence there is for a deity.

Why don't you go and read a REAL book?

Can you demonstrate objective evidence there is anything else?

What evidence would you accept that invisible unicorns exist that are undetectable in any objective way?

Do you theists even read the stuff you write?

Why don't you just give us what evidence you have? Then we can decide for ourselves.

AJ777, first, you need to define what you are trying to prove.

Is anyone remotely surprised that every time you ask a theist to demonstrate some evidence the silence is deafening?

Please stay on topic, your attempts do move the goal posts or change the subject has become wearisome and predictably inane. YOU began this thread, the topic morality.

Do you read a single post presented to you, or do the hamsters in your head just keep spinning round and round on that little wheel?

Do you know how to write a sentence without engaging in fallacious arguments?

Can you really not grasp that a fictional tale can be assessed for it's morality?

Do most Christian countries still stone people to death for adultery?

Ever read the Theory of General Relativity and Theory of Special Relativity?

Ever read anything written by Stephen Hawking?

Ever watch the debate between your revered William Lane Craig and Sean Carroll, where Sean Carroll made William Lane Craig look like the idiotic buffoon he is?

Remember The Nine Razors? (Update: There are now The Ten Razors.)

What you are saying is: Absolute Truth ≠ true but ≡ false ≡ Absolute Truth = true? You mean to tell me you cannot determine and comprehend your error?

Even if there was an objective moral law giver, why on Earth would it give those laws to the monsters depicted in the Bible and the Quran, such as Abraham the infanticide, Moses the murderer, and Mohammed the child-raping warlord?

Have you read a single post anyone has submitted?

AJ777: "Arakish, if truth is relative then lying is not a measurable or meaningful act." Arakish: The sky is pink and purple swirling in miasmic psychedelic patterns. What part of that statement is lie? What part is not measurable? What part is meaningful?

Please demonstrate how you know anything "must exist"?

Can we both agree that torturing children for no reason is immoral?

Would you think torturing children for fun was immoral if you realised no deity existed? What reason other than religious dogma makes you think it is wrong?

Why was it OK, according to the bible, for your deity to murder and torture children?

Do you torture your children by forcing them to believe in the immoral monster in the Bible?

Do objective morals come from your god?

Isn't it interesting that when you step around this holy book and actually think for yourself, it becomes too easy to be a better person than this god thingy?

Please give your thoughts on how such an immoral monster such as William Lane Craig can exist?

Christianity is a religion, what part of that don't you understand?

Is jesus in heaven, or is everything about jesus, including his soul, totally gone?

If religion is so damned good for us, then why does it seem to spawn so much more violent crime?

Why is 90+% of all child molestors self-identified as Christian?

If atheism is so immoral, then why does the prison population only have 0.02% (1 in 5000) atheists?

Can you explain how your religion is not amoral from the bottom up?

Do you treat people how you want to be treated?

Is there, then, enough evidence for those who neither want nor don’t want any gods?

Would you kill your child if god told you to?

If you are going to be an apologist for God, why did you attack atheism for a property that does not define it?

Are you the old John Breezy?

AJ777: "there is a difference between descriptive and prescriptive literature on the Bible." And how does one tell the difference? Is it objectively obvious, or is some kind of subjective interpretation involved? Who has the authority to decide which passages are descriptive or prescriptive?

Do you really not understand what amoral principle is?

Do you believe that the Bible is true? Do you believe the Bible is a moral guide? Do you believe the deity in the is real and perfectly moral?

Are you saying murder is immoral? So your saying your deity is immoral then, or the bible is nonsense? No more pretending you don't believe it is true to dodge these questions. Which is it?

Are you just an automaton incapable of moral reasoning?

Do you torture your children by forcing the Bible down their throats? Do you torture your children by forcing them to believe in that immoral monster in the Bible? Do you torture your children by telling them they were born evil/sinful? Do you torture your children with the threat of Hell unless they behave as you tell them to behave instead of letting them be the children they are?

If everything, as YOU put it, has a cause, then what caused your deity to exist?

Can you define what meaning or purpose Christianity gives to life in a way that is anything but redundant from a Christian perspective?

If your deity exists, then why does it play this perpetual game of hide-and-can't-seek?

But why do you think that carrying out actions within the laws of nature prove someone to be objectively moral?

Do you think there is a truth without evidence?

So what is this Truth you are speaking of?

Why do you think religion is so opposed to science and the Scientific Method?

2nd Kings 2:23-24: "He [Elisha] went up from there to Bethel. As he was going up by the way, some youths came out of the city and mocked him, and said to him, “Go up, you baldy! Go up, you baldy!” He looked behind him and saw them, and cursed them in Yahweh’s name. Then two female bears came out of the woods, and mauled forty-two of those youths." Now I ask you. Does calling someone with a bald head "baldy" warrant the death penalty? To be mauled to death by two female bears?

Are you finding it increasingly difficult to answer these questions? Ever stop to wonder why? Perhaps because your answers have to get more and more convoluted to answer the questions, twisting yourself in a pretzel to try and answer them?

Do you really think we don't know why you won't answer our questions?

Do you EVER stop and think about what you are typing before posting?

Is it not embarrassing to you to know that everything you have posted is fallacious?

Have you changed from objective morality to objective truth on purpose and dishonestly?

The only message of ALL Christendom is, “You are condemned to Hell forever unless you believe as WE tell you to believe and do as WE tell you to do and think only what WE tell you to think.” If that ain't terrorism, then what is it?

So what objective evidence do you have that objective morals exist?

Which religion isn't evil?

Based on what you know about various religions do you consider all of them to be good and without fault?

Can you prove there is such a thing as "science of the gaps"?

Which of your beliefs can you substantiate with objective evidence?

Are you being ignorant or dishonest?

Please help us understand what about atheism you think makes it a religion?

What are the beliefs that you think atheists hold?

What are these claims you assert atheists are making about a world view? Where is this belief system you speak of?

Are you really sure English is your primary language?

Which Christianity is true? Mormon, JW, Catholicism, Pentecostal, Calvinist,…? 30 thousand different sects all calling the other sects false can not all be true?

Please tell me how a bunch of fignation of imagiments (Bible) could ever give anyone's life any meaning?

Please show me one example of me "preaching the religion of atheism".

Do you really expect us to believe you can't Google the meaning of these words? Or read them in the multiple responses that have been given each time you repeat this lie?

Shouldn't you feel more threatened by other religions that are far more powerful and actually have an agenda against you are your personal belief?

Why does religion REQUIRE the mental rape, emotional molestation, and psychological terrorism of eternal damnation and torment?

How do you come to the conclusion that your Christian beliefs are the one and only true truth when there are so many other sects and other religions claiming the same?

How do you determine truth?

Why should I not be able to form an opinion on what is right and what is wrong? You Religious Absolutists do it all the time. Even if it goes against your obsolete texts. What makes you so damned privileged?

Why should anyone cede to religion the RIGHT to tell us what is good and what is evil? Why should anyone cede to religion the RIGHT to tell us what we can and cannot think?

Where do you think human rights came from? Were they granted by god, or were they earned through centuries of conflict and cooperation in human societies?

Do you honestly expect any Religitard to admit that they are a liar?

How is it you CANNOT see this most simplest of truths?

Have you truly and purposefully retarded your mental faculties with your religion to the poin that you cannot think for yourself?

Must you always go back to the book of collected plagiarized lies?

Even if your God exists outside of normal space and time, anything it does to this realm will leave evidence. Where is that evidence?

Do you honestly expect me to believe that your God created such a huge universe with all those galaxies and stars and planets just for a single species of backward, primitive, barbaric primates on only one insignificant planet orbiting an insignificant star located in an insignificant galaxy?

What is the whole premise of religion?

Have you returned to stop using avoidance and muddying the waters?

Have you returned to stop skipping over our questions or shifting our questions with a question of your own?

Have you returned to stop squirimg away from questions for which you have no answer and ready to admit “I do not know” when you do not have answer?

Have you returned to stop dancing around by spewing presupposed assumtive assertion with no evidence after presupposed assumtive assertion with no evidence after presupposed assumtive assertion with no evidence?

Have you returned to act like a human being and to treat others like a human being?

I wonder if this is a new record for these forum boards?

rmfr

Sat, 01/26/2019 - 07:25

(Reply to #106) #107

toto974

I love the point 49.

Sat, 01/26/2019 - 09:22

(Reply to #107) #108

Empedocles

This is too good for me to

This is too good for me to pass up. I'm going to take 20 at a time until I get bored or distracted by another thread.

Is it not more important how to think, than to be told what to think?

How to think is important, that's education. What to think is propaganda. All art, however, is propaganda. When we state opinions, criticisms or debate ancient texts is that propaganda? Sometimes.

Is it objectively moral to threaten children with mental rape, emotional molestation, and psychological terrorism of eternal damnation in your Hell (for it is not biblical) and teaching them that they are born evil and sinful due to an evil and sinful act?

Morality is subjective. Objective morality seems like a contradiction in terms. Hell isn't a Bible teaching. The other accusations would have to be debated one at a time.

If my father just happened to have robbed a bank, is it even conceivable that I, his son, should also be put into prison for his crime? That my children, his grandchildren, should also be put into prison for his crime?

I suppose it is conceivable, but more likely that the children and grandchildren would suffer the consequences of the imprisonment, though not actually being punished for the crime.

Show me any religion that is moral, for there are none.

I loath organized religion primarily because mass appeal and the corruption of power tends to corrupt and transmogrify the original teachings. Taoism and Christianity are stunning examples of this, but they all do it, except possibly for Shintoism because of it's original syncretistic nature.

Have you even read the Bible? Using critical thinking, logical and deductive reasoning, and rational and analytical thought? Do you even know what critical thinking, logical and deductive reasoning, and rational and analytical thought are? Do you even know how to comprehensively read?

That's pretty rough. I've discovered that atheists tend to boast of these wonderful abilities while often just shooting off their fucking mouths with uninformed opinions, but let's just let that play out and we'll see who can put back it up.

Do you believe the Divine Command Morality is objectively moral?

Again, it's a contradiction in terms. Morality was prescribed differently by Jehovah over periods of time. What was moral for Adam wasn't necessarily moral for Moses, or Jesus, or Paul. My Bible beliefs indicate to me that morality in a basic sense is instilled in all of us. We seem "wired" to know what is right and wrong in this sense.

Provide evidence that no philosophical ideology is not more divisive than religion.

Do you make such frequent use of the double negative intentionally? I loath organized religion and philosophy so I guess I'll have to leave this one to AJ777. I will say anything can be as or more divisive than religion. Politics, fashion, sports, love, music, art, class, etc.

Prove religion does not do nothing but pervert, demoralize, subvert, and bribe all persons with the belief that it possesses the one and only truth.

Does not do nothing but . . . well, higher education, colleges were basically founded by the Catholic Church, and it could be said that that's where science was born. Islam pretty much preserved classical learning and the philosophical insight of antiquity through the dark ages. Many religions, as loathsome as they are, are far more charitable than any atheistic entity that I've ever heard of.

Prove religion is not an ideology that is implicitly and explicitly protected from any and all criticism from both within and without. Why should any ideology, especially religion, be so privileged? Can you not see how disastrous this way of thinking can be, and is?

Yeah, I saw it when I made my first post here.

Where did you ever get the idea Religion is not evil?

No more or less evil than any other endeavor of mankind.

Can you demonstrate objective evidence anything in any religion has an origin that is not entirely human?

Can you demonstrate objective evidence what you had for lunch last Tuesday? Terms like evidence and proof are abused by uninformed atheists.

Prove religion does not condemn people as an "abomination" because they happen to have been born gay. Insists everyone worship an angry unevidenced deity that it also claims committed genocide. The same deity according to the bible tortured a new born baby to death over 7 days because it was angered it was conceived in an adulterous affair. One wonders what anyone's standard for evil behaviour is if this doesn't fit the description?

Well, I'm gay, though I don't think I was born that way. That's debatable, though. God doesn't insist everyone worship him, committed genocide? That seems highly unlikely since he created two people who propagated all people and we're still here. But if he had committed genocide I suppose, as creator, he would have the authority to do that with good reason. The infant you speak of has the hope of resurrection and, again, God had good reason to do that.

Are you saying you don't think acts like genocide, rapine, murder, slavery, homophobia, misogyny, and torture are all immoral and/or evil? The bible condones them all.

Does it really, now? No it doesn't, but again the point is moot because morality is subjective.

Why do so many theists never read dictionaries?

That's a new one on me. Read dictionaries? One doesn't read dictionaries like a book, they reference it.

What makes you think morality is not subjective?

It is subjective.

Do you think god and religion are the same thing?

They can be.

Are you going to offer anything substantive to the responses people have made, or were you just wasting everyone's time?

It looks to me like he his cup runneth over.

Where do you get off pretending you know something about morality?

No more or less than you I would imagine.

Are you claiming you do not know whether murder is wrong unless you're told by a deity?

No.

Do you believe murder is immoral, or do you just desist because you think a deity wants you to?

What is the obsession with morality? Murder is often thought to be immoral.

Sun, 01/27/2019 - 07:28

(Reply to #108) #109

Sheldon

Empedocles "Hell isn't a

Empedocles "Hell isn't a Bible teaching."

Revelation 21:8

8 But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars—they will be consigned to the fiery lake of burning sulphur. This is the second death.”

https://www.biblestudytools.com/topical-verses/hell-bible-verses/

Have you even read the bible?

Sun, 01/27/2019 - 13:10

(Reply to #109) #110

Empedocles

Part 2

Do you believe murder is immoral, or do you just desist because you think a deity wants you to?

What is the difference? Morality is often presented in the guise of cowardice. Am I not going to hurt you because I'm moral or because I know that to do so would hurt me? Morality is subjective. We've been through this several times.

Do you think morals are objective?

[sigh] I can see where AJ777 would get frustrated at these questions.

Do you think morals come from your god?

In a sense, yes.

Is there any context in which genocide could be morally justified?

Sure.

Is there any context in which you think slavery can be morally justified?

Obviously. Where and when has there not been slavery? Someone must have morally justified it. You keep bringing up morals and then criticize other cultures from other times for their morality. You are a slave. A slave to debt in a debt based economy. A slave to fractional reserve bankers.

Is sending people to eternal damnation and torment morally justifiable due to the simple reason a person chooses not to believe due to absolutely no evidence that your deity exists?

Hmmm . . . I have to think about that . . . . I would have to say possibly. There are some factors there to consider, some of them having to do with the way in which you formulated the question. 1. The Bible doesn't teach a literal torment for any reason. 2. Morality is subjective. 3. The person's choice. It's his / her responsibility no matter what the evidence and 4. Evidence is also subjective.

Please, provide OBJECTIVE HARD EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE that your deity even exists.

No.

Why the metaphors in the Bible? Why can they not speak plainly and simply on the issue; why the vagueness? Is it perhaps because humans wrote, edited, translated, printed, copied, plagiarized, and all this ×100 times or more that is vague, or is it because this all powerful "god" idea likes to be vague on the one of the extremely rare times this "god" idea tries to communicate to humans?

The later. At Matthew 13:34-35 Jesus quotes Psalm 78:2 which clearly indicates intent. So editing and mistranslation or whatever wasn't the reason for it. Metaphors, parables, illustrations etc. are effective for 5 reasons. 1. They get your attention 2. They provoke thught. 3. They apply to the emotion, which is more in line with how people think. Emotionally rather than logically. 4. They aid memory. and 5. They preserve truth, transcending time and place.

If your deity is all-knowing, then why does it only speak one language? Why must your deity rely on fallacious humans to translate its given word? Why could your deity not give its wisdom to all the peoples of the Earth? Why did your deity choose the most primitive peoples as its chosen people when the Chinese were well more advanced in philosophy and technology than a bunch of primitive desert-dwelling goat-herders?

When the Bible was written, in 3 different languages, the people in the area where it was written spoke many more languages than that. Nevertheless, you're going to criticize the creator of the universe and everything in it or primitive desert dwelling goat herders for incompetence when the Bible is translated in just about every language known to man, available throughout the world thousands of years later?

I see good and evil as qualities of certain actions and people relative to their effect on other people. Do you see good as a substance with independent existence; something that can be extracted and removed?

I see good and evil as subjective terms. Your idea of good and evil comes from somewhere and where do you think that is? It depends upon where you were born and lived, at least to a certain extent. So let's say you reject the morality of the Bible because of something like slavery. Was there slavery in your past, your ancestors and your culture? Now do you reject those morals or do you unwittingly adhere to them.

How come your absolute morality is so relativistic?

Is it? Perhaps this is a question for AJ777 specifically.

If Hell is evil, is it not also evil to condemn someone to Hell?

Yes. If it existed, which it doesn't.

Doesn't the Bible also have a commandment to stone unruly children to death?

Deuteronomy 21:21. How old do you think the child this applies to would have been? An adult child.

Doesn't the Bible also condone slavery and rapine?

No.

If the Bible is objetively moral, then I can get me a new young wife to take care of me in my old age by going down the road and raping my neighbor's 14 year old daughter, pay him the equivalent of 50 shekels of silver (about $200). Deuteronomy 22:28-29: “If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found; then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel’s father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath humbled her, he may not put her away all his days.” How about that for objective morality?

It's an incorrect view of scripture. And even if it wasn't it would no longer apply. It only applied to the ancient Israelite until the covenant was broken and remade through Christ. It wouldn't apply to Christians because it would be against the law of most countries, and wasn't applicable to Christians anyway.

What's wrong with addressing all the answers everyone has given to you already?

Nothing.

Which of the commandments forbids rape or torture?

Well, specifically none, but coveting, loving your neighbor and God would forbid torture. Rape was a crime against the Law of Moses. There are more than 10 commandments, you know.

Which commandment requires parents to protect and cherish their children?

Deuteronomy 4:9

Is the Noah flood a myth?

No.

Are you saying global genocide is not evil?

Evil is subjective.

Is it evil or not to murder Job's entire family and torment him just to win a bet?

It certainly could be. I think it is.

Sat, 01/26/2019 - 12:23

(Reply to #110) #111

Sky Pilot

arakish,

"I wonder if this is a new record for these forum boards?"

Your new nickname is "Perry Mason".

Sun, 01/27/2019 - 02:10

(Reply to #111) #112

arakish

LMAOWF rmfr

LMAOWF

rmfr

Sat, 01/26/2019 - 02:42

#113

Empedocles

Why four? Isn't the one

Why four? Isn't the one enough?

Sat, 01/26/2019 - 07:12

(Reply to #113) #114

arakish

@ Empedocles

But is not four better than one?

rmfr

Sat, 01/26/2019 - 06:53

#115

AJ777

Arakish, funny! Here’s

Arakish, funny! Here’s another. Didn’t a moderator on this forum reprimand you and advise that no one is required to answer any and every question posed?

Sat, 01/26/2019 - 07:14

(Reply to #115) #116

Sheldon

Is it immoral to torture

Is it immoral to torture children? If so, why do you think it is?

Are you ever going to stop trolling by the way, I don't really care, but it says a great deal about how closed minded your beliefs are that you behave like this when people offer cogent objections you cannot answer.

Sat, 01/26/2019 - 07:20

(Reply to #116) #117

arakish

⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ and what he

⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ and what he said ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑

rmfr

Sat, 01/26/2019 - 07:18

(Reply to #117) #118

arakish

@ AJ777

“Didn’t a moderator on this forum reprimand you and advise that no one is required to answer any and every question posed?”

No. The Mod informed YOU that you do not have to answer every question. My point is that you have not answered even one question that was posed at you.

And I also have the right to show the proof of how great of an evasive deceiver you are. Just like ALL Religious Absolutists.

And as in your avatar, why is not your deity helping you since you seem unable to help yourself? (Question 168 you will never answer…)

rmfr

Sat, 01/26/2019 - 07:32

(Reply to #118) #119

xenoview

The moderator told him, he

The moderator told him, he couldn't tell people to leave AR.

Sat, 01/26/2019 - 07:36

(Reply to #119) #120

arakish

⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ and that also ⇑ ⇑ ⇑

⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ and that also ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑ ⇑

rmfr

Sat, 01/26/2019 - 07:41

#121

CyberLN

I sure wish folks (both

I sure wish folks (both ‘sides’) would actually debate in this debate forum.

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