Here is what this website taught me:
1.No one gives a shit about how I think or feel.
2.Reality is the only thing that matters.
3.Fantasies are stupid.
4.Enjoy life while it lasts.
5.No one will ever agree with me. ever.
6.I am ignorant.
7.I am stupid.
8.Saying life is meaningless is considered a rational thought.
9.Saying that we are nothing but a bunch of cells and sperms is considered a rational thought.
10.Only science should be trusted because they have evidence. Evidence=fact.
11.Saying that souls don't exist doesn't make living less important,
12.All life is precious, unless women get abortions so unborn children are not valuable at all.
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Oh, boy, you are going to set a new record of more new threads in a day.
I don't understand why you keep posting in a place you really dislike that much.
-_-
This went in twice - deleted one.
@ No one gives a shit about how I think or feel? (Then why have people taken the time to correct you?)
@ 2.Reality is the only thing that matters. (Um..... what else is there?)
@ 3.Fantasies are stupid. (Not if they are profitable. J.R. Rowling is making a killing. Fantasies are stupid when you mistake them for reality. If you get a broom, think it is magic, and jump off a building pretending to fly, you are a moron.,
@ Enjoy life while it lasts. (Sounds good to me.)
@ 5.No one will ever agree with me. ever. (Um... That's what happens when you are living in a fantasy.)
@ 6.I am ignorant. (That should be self evident. The difference between you and the rest of the people on the site is that you pretend you know stuff. You don't actually know that you are ignorant while the rest of us are wallowing in curiosity about all that we do not know. Ignorance is the beginning of knowledge.)
@ Stupid? 1. having or showing a great lack of intelligence or common sense. Whether or not you are stupid remains to be seen. I would assert that a stupid person is one that can not learn. They just don't have the ability. Stupidity is distinct from ignorance and yet they can look the same at times. So the question is... are you actually learning anything at all from any of this?
@ Saying life is meaningless is considered a rational thought. (Obviously you are not paying attention. The meaning of life is to perpetuate life. If you think it has another meaning, please elaborate. Life perpetuates life to feed on life. Life lives by consuming life. This is a FACT. I am not sure if there is another fact about life. Things that live will live until they die? Life is not the important thing. The important thing is this; "Now that you have a life, what will you do with it."
@ 9.Saying that we are nothing but a bunch of cells and sperms is considered a rational thought. Well we are a bunch of cells. Correct. I have not been a sperm for a long time but it is a fact that I was once a sperm. These are both rational ideas.
@ 10.Only science should be trusted because they have evidence. Evidence=fact. (Once again you appear to be confused. Science is not a thing and it has nothing. Science is a method. It is a method of examining things. It is a method of looking at an assertion, hypothesis, and establishing its validity through observation, experimentation, repetition, and it's ability to make predictions in the world around us. It is the technique that moves the human mind away from fantasy and conjecture into a world that is real, measurable, predictable, understandable, and usable.)
@ 11.Saying that souls don't exist doesn't make living less important. (EXCELLENT! There is no reason to assume anything called a "soul" exists. My life is important to me anyway.)
@ 12.All life is precious, (What makes you think that. As you were typing this message 20 or 30 babies died of starvation or disease around the world. Babies you could have saved if only you were donating your time and money. How precious is life? I doubt that anyone actually considers "all life" precious. Not even you..
@ 12B unless women get abortions so unborn children are not valuable at all. This is confusing. Unborn children have great worth in the world of stem cell research. We could be using them to cure disease. Unfortunately, in the USA all research is being blocked. Not so in Russia or Korea. Korea is making amazing medical discoveries while the USA is stagnant.
I am only 17 years old. I just finished my second year of high school and I am still living with my parents. I do not have the ability to spend all of my money to help others, since me and my family are struggling to support ourselves.
You are very glum at the moment. But I don't think your evaluation of this site is correct. However there is no need to be downhearted about that. My idea about being found to be wrong, (if one is wrong), is that it is a good thing. The reason for that, is that if I have been found to be wrong, then I am now less wrong, and maybe even right. If a person shows me why I'm wrong, they may also show me what is right. If they don't show me what is right, at least I know in the future, to be on the lookout for ideas, arguments, etc., which may allow me to correct my errors.
I don't want to hold on to incorrect ideas, just because I hate to be wrong. Just as when the doctor tells me I'm ill, I don't feel good about it, but at least he can help me get well, or put me on the alert that I need to get well one way or another. In one of your other threads, Michael, I took your comments point by point, and in most cases put a positive spin in reply to each one.
I am sure I said, for example, that I DO NOT consider you to be worthless, and that your posting here is a good and positive thing, because we all get the chance to think about things, using your input as the stimulus. I think I'll respond to each of your latest points now . . .
1.No one gives a shit about how I think or feel.
I'm sure that people do, and their paying you attention on this website, shows that they do. A problem is that w cannot agree with everything that you say, but if I for instance, did not give a sh*t, I just wouldn't respond as I do. Surely, you want to learn, and to become a better thinker and a better person. Us just agreeing with you, won't necessarily help you with that.
2.Reality is the only thing that matters.
Reality is the only thing there is. Whatever there is, that is what is reality. If there be a god, if there be devils, if there be angels or faeries, then that would be reality. I don't believe that there are gods, devils, angels or faeries, nor souls, a heaven and so on. That doesn't mean that you are not allowed to believe in such things. The question is, "Can you believe in some, or all of those things and be wrong?"
Even though I don't believe in those things I mentioned, there is loads of things in reality, enough to fill up a lifetime, things with value to me, and to the world.
3.Fantasies are stupid.
Do you think fantasies are stupid, Michael? I don't. My favourite kind of art is called "Surrealist Art". Go and check some Google images of surreal art. I love the crazy, zany, fantasy of it. It's plain fun to me - harmless fun. I also think it's important that I understand that it is just fantasy, and not real. But it's not stupid - not to me. Don't you like movies, Michael? Many movies are basically fantasy. Good entertainment, fun, and not stupid. Batman isn't real, not part of reality, Batman is someone's fantasy.
4.Enjoy life while it lasts.
Of course.
I'm a lot older than you, Michael, and was young in the 1960's, the hippy era. There was a popular saying then, and it was: "Do whatever you want to do, be whoever you'd like to be - just so long as you don't hurt ANYBODY". I put the word ANYBODY in upper case, because one's self is included in "anybody".
5.No one will ever agree with me. ever.
I bet there's loads that we agree on, right now.
6.I am ignorant.
Everybody is ignorant. The best and wisest people on the earth are ignorant of something. You may be less ignorant about some things than loads of other people. Anybody who knows everything, has nothing to learn. I sure have lots that I could learn. I learned today, that you are 17 years old, in your second year of high school, and live with your parents. Between you, you don't have a lot of money. Yesterday, and all of the days before that, I was ignorant about those things - now I'm not.
7.I am stupid.
We're all stupid, too. I do a lot of dumb things. I'm not perfect, and no one is. I am not completely stupid, and surely, neither are you.
8.Saying life is meaningless is considered a rational thought.
No, life can have meaning, and each person can give their life meaning. I reckon that I pointed out that you could give your life a worthwhile meaning, if you studied or trained, to become a doctor, a train driver, a teacher, a firefighter, a garbage collector, a lawyer, a shop assistant, an actor, etc. It's up to each of us to figure out what we think is worthwhile, and go after that as a way of making life worthwhile.
I remember a little anecdote that is attributed to Winston Churchill :-
There are three steps to success . . .
1. Never give up;
2. Never give up;
3. Never give up.
9.Saying that we are nothing but a bunch of cells and sperms is considered a rational thought.
I'm sure that I posted my thoughts on that before. We are a bunch of cells, and chemicals, but those cells and chemicals have marvellous properties. They let us live, and breathe, and think, and enjoy. So we are not JUST a bunch of cells and chemicals. [By the way, sperms are the male cells in the testicles. Ladies don't have sperms ~ not of their own, any way. Female humans have ova, in their ovaries].
10.Only science should be trusted because they have evidence. Evidence=fact.
Science can be trusted, within its sphere of applicability. It's a big subject, science and evidence and facts. I wouldn't expect a 17 year old to understand all of that, but it does not make you stupid, just the same as most other 17 year olds, including me, when I was your age. You can learn more, as time goes by.
11.Saying that souls don't exist doesn't make living less important,
No, it doesn't, and just saying that souls don't exist, doesn't necessarily mean that they don't. But I don't say that "souls don't exist". What I do say is that I have no good reason to believe that souls exist, so I don't believe that they exist.
Michael, do you have good reasons to say that souls DO exist ? ? ?
12.All life is precious, unless women get abortions so unborn children are not valuable at all.
The answer to this depends. Some women get pregnant when they don't want to. This could be by accident, or by rape. Abortion may prevent the birth of a child that would be unwanted. At the time of abortion, the foetus has no say in it, nor any opinion. By the way, as humans, we have to take life and destroy it to survive. We pull carrots out of the ground to eat. Carrots are alive. We spray bugs to kill them.
It's a complicated thing this idea of all life being valuable. LIfe is precious, but it's not a blanket statement. Humans kill other humans during wars, just to keep from their loved ones getting killed, or themselves, (defending the nation, for example). Tough issues, that take a long time in a person's life, for them to sort out.
OK - best wishes, Michael,
Mutorc S'yriah
Damn you Cog! Beat me to it!
I don’t really know you or your beliefs Michael so I’m going to try to address your points as unbiased as I can.
1. How you feel has no determination over what is true or not.
2. Everything YOU perceive in the world, religious or not, is all within YOUR reality. Therefore yes, reality is the most important thing in the world. To everyone. Everything that happens to us on a daily basis is part of our reality. Even other people’s realities are shared with yours. We all have the same reality, it’s just how you decide to accept or deny that reality and then force that possible disbelief of reality on others that concerns me.
3. No, fantasies are not stupid. Unless you try to portray said fantasy as reality. Then the fantasy becomes more of a problem than just stupid. A problem with accepting reality in general.
4. Why would you not enjoy life while it lasts. For all you can 100%, absolutely, positively know, this is all you get. Why waste it?
5. That depends on what kind of ideas you’re putting forth towards other people. If you’re telling rational people that your opinion is rational when it isn’t, those people will never agree with you. Also if you don’t like what people are doing here, you are free to leave at your own leisure. No one is forcing you to stay by any stretch of the imagination.
6. Depends on your views which I don’t know.
7. Again this depends on what you’re putting forth. I wouldn’t necessarily call someone stupid for believing in something they want to, I would say that the belief itself is stupid and should be assessed properly based on the evidence before being completely accepted.
8. No one says life is meaningless. You make your own meaning. I’m sure you have things you enjoy doing. Personally I love making music. That’s a huge meaning for my life, to help others through whatever they are going through in the form of songs they can relate to. My girlfriend is another big one. The list is quite extensive. You don’t need some objective purpose to make your life meaningful.
9. Well yes that’s kind of what cell theory and the theory of evolution point towards. Both of which have been verified countless times by scientific study and scrutiny. I’d like to know what evidence you have to the contrary. If your being technical, we are all made by stars because stars produce the elements that make up the chemical composition of our bodies and all other living organisms.
10. Evidence is the closest you can come to or what leads directly to the truth. If there is no evidence of something happening or something existing, we cannot logically say that it must exist or that there’s even a possibility of its existence. Science is the best method we have of explaining the universe because it works. It’s been proven to work countless times.
11. That’s absolutely correct. Because you are still alive. You have more than you probably know to live for. Life is hard sometimes but it’s also exciting and amazing. Think about he discoveries you could make in the future. How exciting would that be for you to revolutionize science or medicine. The betterment of mankind is always worth striving for. Whether god is real or not.
12. I will second Cog’s answer on this one.
LOL - Still the comments are remarkably similar.
Great minds think alike my friend!
@Michael Re: "3. Fantasies are stupid"
If that is what you think, you really need to learn to use your imagination more. Man, I sometimes have some GREAT fantasies that help me to ge-.... err-uh... ummmm.... well....Uh, let's just say they are useful sometimes. *innocent grin*
Actually, fantasies can be great. The trick is to understand and know they are fantasies. They are NOT REAL. Reading a fictional book is fantasy and a great way to unwind after a long, hectic day. Watching a sci-fi movie is always fun and sparks the imagination. Nothing stupid about either of those things. But, again, they are only fantasies. Not reality. And - yes - sadly, sometimes reality can absolutely suck. Sorry. Goes with the territory. That is why a little fantasy every now and then is a good way to temporarily step away from the reality to give the mind a chance to recover and take a break. Nothing at all stupid about fantasy, as long as it is used for its intended purposes of entertainment.
@Tin-Man
Fantasy every now and then? Lol we talking like 2-3 times a day or like 18? Lol sorry couldn’t resist bro
@Justin
Ummm.... Hang on a sec..... Gotta do some tallying...*tapping keys on a calculator*.... Hmmm.... *scratching head*... That can't be right...*puzzled look*.... That number seems way too low.....*more tapping on calculator*.... Uh, hey, Justin, I'll have to get back with you on that....*tapping calculator keys*....
I think I can logically deduce a conclusion from there LOL
You give your own life meaning. It would be foolish to be defined and limited by others.
@Michael: I am only 17 years old.
"When I was seventeen
It was a very good year
It was a very good year for small town girls
And soft summer nights" --Frank Sinatra
Old Frank was wrong about that one. Seventeen is a very bad year. Too big to act like a kid anymore. Too young to do what grown-ups do. Hormones going haywire. And in among all that angst you're supposed to study and pass exams. It's doubly unbearable if you've been buried in a shitload of religious guilt.
All I can say is, this too shall pass.
@Algebe Re: It Was A Very Good Year
That is a fantastic song. I love that song.
Tin-Man:
Yeah. I like 21 and 35 best. And even the autumn of my years.
I miss Frank.
@Algebe
Re: "I miss Frank"
I miss his daughter, too. I love "Boots".
Nancy's still around.
Remember "Some Velvet Morning"?
No. I'll have to look it up. I remember "Summerwine" and "Lightning's Girl".
Seconded.
Can I also just say there's nothing wrong with fantasy, fantasy is something most of us enjoy at some point. Films books theatre etc. Also fantasy is fed by imagination and this advances science in new directions.
The problem is when fantasy is touted as fact, and reality is distorted to accomadate that fantasy. Like Breezy denying the scientific reality of species evolution in order to make his creationist fantasy seem real.
I'm going to borrow from Kipling here.
"If you can dream—and not make dreams your master;
If you can think—and not make thoughts your aim;
If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same; "
Profound words... Definitely applies to me...
From Sheldon's Post above:
I'm going to borrow from Kipling here.
"If you can dream—and not make dreams your master;
If you can think—and not make thoughts your aim;
If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same; "
I included link above in case replies push this too far down. Maybe I should start reading some Kipling...
rmfr