Who would want to believe in a god that had his son killed?

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nttnt's picture
Who would want to believe in a god that had his son killed?

Dear Christian theists,

The Christian god supposedly let his son die to forgive the sins of mankind.

Problems I have with this

1. Why couldn't he just forgive humanity without letting his son get killed?
2. It's messed up that instead of just forgiving humanity, your god decided to let his son get killed.
3. Why would you want to follow someone like that?

The list goes on and on here people.


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Lmale's picture
Its quite simple its a lie.

Its quite simple its a lie. Its a scene designed to present the power and 'love' god has.

nttnt's picture
I would "dig deeper", but it

I would "dig deeper", but it would be a waste of time, because none of it really happened. There is no need for a god to exist, and especially not one who would do such a thing as that.

Steve's picture
I'm guessing that as ritual

I'm guessing that as ritual sacrifice(of animals at least) was probably still prevalent at the time the bible was invented, it was probably seen as a poignant sacrificial 'offering' from god to humanity (instead of humans sacrificing something to god). I'd imagine that the symbolic duality of both sacrifice and martyrdom was also an important part of the message - sort of "Look people, not only am I sacrificing my son for you, but I am also martyring myself for you too".

Imagine the bible was being written today, and Jesus was sacrificed by lethal injection or electric chair. Can you imagine how ridiculous christians would look wearing a little chair around their neck, or the absurdity of every church in the world having an enormous hypodermic needle at the top of its spire.

How otherwise intelligent, functioning people cannot see how obvious (and at the same time completely ridiculous) all this symbolism and metaphor happens to be is beyond me. I mean, it's understandable how illiterate, superstitious and gullible peasants who didn't know if the sun was going to rise tomorrow morning would fall for this shit, but now - in the 21st century?

nttnt's picture
I agree completely with you

I agree completely with you steve. I would have thought that by now, the majority of people would have come to their senses.

Jeff Vella Leone's picture
First of all, only 4 of the

First of all, only 4 of the gospels had him killed, so it wasn't that important at the time of its creation.
Secondly , the purpose was to make the Jews appear as bad as possible so they would suffer antisemitism(as they did).
If the common people thought that they were so stupid to crucify their own messiah no one will believe them and follow them, thus the Romans would not have to face the peasants/slaves too when the Jews rebelled.
It is just propaganda tactic during times of war, that we use even today.

Lmale's picture
Fact is no matter what they

Fact is no matter what they claim in their heart the bible is all that matters so using it to prove that its wrong is really the only way to reach some people.

efpierce's picture
Good points all; if we are to

Good points all; if we are to argue, we do need to know both sides of the story very well and, as atheists, aren't we all just a little but smarter than the rest of the world since we are trying to ask the questions that everyone else seems to avoid?

Ellie Harris's picture
No we are not efpierce.

No we are not efpierce.

Jeff Vella Leone's picture
Well for me it wasn't an

Well for me it wasn't an argument.
You asked a question, I answered.
It doesn't matter if you disagree about my reasons.

Note for your own good though:
If you argue with anybody on any subject without knowing the subject you will in most probability loose the argument even if you are right.

nttnt's picture
I agree jeff and I also think

I agree jeff and I also think that efpierce has a point as well. We ask the questions that no one wants to ask, and we answer the questions theists do not want answered. It does not matter who or what we have to quote to get our point across because, even if they do not accept it, we are still right. There is no god. And if we need to quote their religious text to make an argument then so be it. Right? If that's what it takes to get theists to open their mind, then I see no problem with it.

Lmale's picture
Ramen :)

Ramen :)
I dont think atheists are smarter theists just dont want to know anything that goes against their fairytale so seem dumb on those things.

nttnt's picture
That would make them ignorant

That would make them ignorant AND stupid.

Lmale's picture
No just ignorant they have

No just ignorant they have the capability just chose not to use it.

nttnt's picture
The definition of stupidity

The definition of stupidity is "behavior that shows a lack of good sense or judgment."
Them not choosing to accept the fact is by definition, stupid.

Lmale's picture
Then the definition is wrong.

Then the definition is wrong. I would accept ignorant and stubborn but they are not stupid iq tests have proved that.

nttnt's picture
Then we shall agree to

Then we shall agree to disagree. Agreed?

Jeff Vella Leone's picture
Lmale they are stupid,

Lmale they are stupid, anybody that thinks that you should follow what you are told without question or dobt is stupid.
anybody that thinks that doubt itself is a bad thing is stupid.

It is what I call beeing brainwashed to be stupid.

They might be bright in some other aspects but the tendancy is that that they are not.

The question is the best thing we human have.
And it comes from doubting about something.
If you negate that part of you basic instinct about ANY subject you are stupid.

CyberLN's picture
I don't think it's an all or

I don't think it's an all or nothing deal. People can be very bright about some things and not so bright about others.

Jeff Vella Leone's picture
as i said, the tendency is

as i said, the tendency is that they are not.

CyberLN's picture
Then do you agree that it's

Then do you agree that it's not all or nothing? That a theist can sometimes be brilliant about/at some things?

Jeff Vella Leone's picture
I"m am not saying that it is

I"m am not saying that it is not possible but there is no evidence that suggest that a theist is exceptionally smart about about anything.

Jeff Vella Leone's picture
If someone cannot even see

If someone cannot even see that his own doubt is a good thing, how can he see reality how it is?
Without a proper picture of reality, one cannot ask the right questions, thus he end up getting the wrong answers.
Ignorance place a part too.
But the acceptance to keep being ignorant is what makes theists stupid.
Considering doubt as the opposite of faith(thus a sin) is the reason they are stupid.

Jeff Vella Leone's picture
Also beeing good at something

Also beeing good at something, doesn't mean they are smart.

One can be the best mechanic, pilot, technician of the wold.
It does not mean they are smart, it just means that they are good at what they do.
Though a process of repetition or love for their hobby or work.

Being smart is the ability to understand any situation better then the average people.

Jeff Vella Leone's picture
You have to see theism like a

You have to see theism like a virus, you infect a normal sane human being with it and you can see him becoming more stupid by the second.
This is shown from the ridiculous arguments they come up with and the fact that they end up just leaving when they realize that they have displayed their stupidity in public.

Chuck Rogers's picture
I have to say but yet I

I have to say but yet I almost don't want to because this is funny. I'm getting a kick out of this debate and not even one Christian involved.

Here are several atheists talking about things that have to do with God, or religion, or theists. The irony of this. Though you all claim to not believe in God, it seems that He sure gets a lot of your attention. I wonder of some of you if you even work, because most of you seem to be on here a lot. Don't take me wrong I don't know if you have a legitimate reason for not. But I just wonder how much of your day is taken up talking about something you claim doesn't exist. It's almost like He arranges things to come about in your lives just to make you talk about Him. I wonder how much He gets a kick out of this. Some of the explanations you give to make you sound so smart really makes some of you sound stupid lol.
Just think about it, you don't believe but you spend so much time arguing even if it's with other non believers. From what I see on this site all of you seem to talk more about God than many Christians do (or at least those who claim to be Christians) I hope you don't just stop because I brought this information to your knowledge. Because I'm really enjoying this. Oh just one more thing. For one who thinks he is so smart he sure has to explain himself a lot.

Jeff Vella Leone's picture
chuck as usual you are a fine

chuck as usual you are a fine example of what I was explaining, ridiculous arguments.

If you read anything at all from what we were writing you MIGHT understand that we were talking about theist not god.
If stupid people can read that is.

Theist do exists unlike their god.
I am at work right now :P
The fact that a smart person has to explain himself is the reason why he is considered smart compared to the others.
If the others don't need an explanation then the others are just as smart.
That being said, I didn't say I was smart neither.
I said that theists are not smart.
There is a difference although I doubt you can understand it.

Chuck Rogers's picture
First of all maybe you should

First of all maybe you should reread my post I not only mentioned God but the word theists was in there also. My point was considering that your not smart, is not just to do with this one forum. It has to do with how much time the atheists on this site spend talking about God or the things of God. By the way considering your last post, it sounds like you think the other atheists on this forum are stupid. Because before my last post there was no Christians in on this. Yet you sure were having to explain yourself a lot.

Jeff Vella Leone's picture
more ridiculous arguments?

more ridiculous arguments?
If you have an unrelated opinion to make make a new topic, if you reply to this topic and to me it means you are replying to me and my posts.
don't show how even more stupid can you get.

You said that we are taking about god that doesn't exist and I said that theists do exist.
Are you retarded or what?
Your entire argument was on that wrong assumption.
It doesn't matter if you said theists, your claim was about god:
"From what I see on this site all of you seem to talk more about God than many Christians do"
we talk about theists and their ridiculous arguments not on their god per se.

I think that theists are stupid in most cases yes.
What a stupid person thinks about what atheists are is irrelevant. If you are trying to make s fight amongst ourselves with such a ridiculous unsupported claim, you are more stupid then I thought.

Jeff Vella Leone's picture
chuck here is something for
Chuck Rogers's picture
Going to bed, will watch it

Going to bed, will watch it in the morning.


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