If we created an atheist religion and used it to funnel tax free money towards educating our kids on all human rights. To counter The things that Christians tell our kids that contribute to what's been going on in Washington. LGBTQ rights, immigrants, refugees, women, climate change. Etc. We could be doing some good? Non profit church? I might be out there on this one.
Subscription Note:
Choosing to subscribe to this topic will automatically register you for email notifications for comments and updates on this thread.
Email notifications will be sent out daily by default unless specified otherwise on your account which you can edit by going to your userpage here and clicking on the subscriptions tab.
I totally agree with you, EXCEPT I don't like the idea of "organized atheism." However, your idea for the purpose of such an organization is spot on!
Oh and BTW. This is only one of the reasons that I am glad you are here. You create content. You post things for people to think about. Sometimes the forum is stagnant and there is literally nothing to read, think, or talk about. You are a font of fresh thought. Thank you for that!
Myke
I think it's a wonderful idea in theory! Not only could services be provided, education, activism etc - all under a nice tax exempt status, but it may also build a sense of community. That could actually bring more awareness to what/who atheism/atheists really are and dispel some of the stigma surrounding it. (I think) part of the beauty of atheism is that it's such a diverse group of people and there are absolutely no constraints put on what we believe. Once you organize something, it takes some of that away. Idk why, but I keep picturing a wild stallion vs a horse in a stable! Lol I think trying to put atheism in a box would be nearly impossible- plus, there are many strong minds/strong wills. However, we can still collectively advocate all of those things. Since there aren't any certain "rules" we must ascribe to, we can do whatever we dream of doing... Be it organized as a religion or not. But on another note, if Scientology can be a "religion" it is definitely not beyond the realm of possibility!!
I love the wild stallion analogy because religion does keep u locked up in so many ways. Believe me when I say I hate organized religion and how its used to dictate agendas to people. I always hated church and I find joy in the fact that i won't ever have to go again.
I just want to some smart atheists to figure out a way to beat religion at its game. Money controls people. Freedom of religious rights in America has been abused so much that its a huge part of political agenda. Scientology was exactly what made me think this isn't fair to atheist. Many Atheist seems on a higher moral ground, in my opinion, than religion drenched people. So lying to get tax exempt status by way of religion might be impossible. If we can step further outside our freedoms as atheists we will see that some of these facts are being attacked by delusional christians.
Time to push back? I guarantee you the brains behind many of the christians who strategized this shit are minimal compared to the knowledge of the atheists I've seen here.
JamieB,
Is there anything to stop you from teaching your kids your views?
You can be another Madalyn Murray O'Hair.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madalyn_Murray_O%27Hair
Diotrphes
I'm confused by your comment. Are you saying if I continue to speak out against religion my children and I could be murdered by fellow atheist or hater of my oppionion? She was murdered along with her family. Seriously disturbing.
So here's my thoughts for now so I can lock the door and go back to sleep. People are hatefully murdered every single day. I've seen more videos of men being killed by the cops or transgender being mutilated murdered for choosing to live a life true to themselves. I care about people and think if most people say nothing hate like this continues to grow. Thankfully I live in a country where freedom of speech is legal and I know all people won't agree with me. My children are encouraged to accept people for their differences, but my goal is not to make little atheist warriors. I'll have to do some thinking on this one. Thanks for your concern Diotrphes.
JamieB,
I thought about Murray since she was a well-known atheist who basically ended prayer in school. And then I went to Wiki to pull her up for reference in case anyone didn't know who she was. I actually didn't know that she had been murdered. The main point I was trying to make is that all ideas and movements start with one person and when that person is motivated he or she can change the world. I think that's amazing. So if you see a need for change step up and get it done. That's the way it happens. Of course there could always be personal negative consequences but everything comes with a price.
Diotrphes
Thank you for clarification:)
I don't ever want to do something to put my kids lives in jeopardy. They are much more important to me than influencing others. I'm trying to find the balance of having a voice and yet listening to other opinions. I'm still learning as my 8 year old would say.
Diotrephes and Everyone else
I have changed my mind on the idea of an atheist religion thanks to the wise words from many of you. It was a bad idea and I'm over it.
I always wondered if those at the very top of religious groups realize it is all bullshit. Or if they simply are the most delusional among them.
I feel certain TV televangelist that fleece desperate people of their money, have to believe that there is no god, unless they twist it around in their heads in incredible ways. Surely people that fleece the desperate must on some level know they are going to hell if they believe in that god.
I also feel top political players are atheist/agnostic they just know it is political suicide to say they are atheist. So instead they use these theist people to get votes. Not all politicians are stupid, the ones that are not are insidious. (With a few rare exceptions of actual decent people politicians.)
Its like the Emperor's New Clothes fairy tale.
http://www.andersen.sdu.dk/vaerk/hersholt/TheEmperorsNewClothes_e.html
No one has the guts to say to the Emperor that he was wearing no clothes. Every one carried on as if these lying weavers were making the most beautiful invisible clothes. No one wanted to be the fool. The scientology doc "Going Clear" has a constant theme throughout of ex scientologist feeling the shame of having wasted so much of their time and money on a foolish thing. Same goes for other religions so people keep quiet. This story also reminds me of Trump because the Emperor is such an iddiot. So that made it fun for me to reread.
Jamie in Trumps case, the emperor has no clues haha
Secularsob
You cracked my clients up today with that line about trump the emperor with no clues. I gave u credit cause that was very witty. :)
Hahaha I'm glad you all enjoyed it Jamie.
lol Yes :) It feels similar to watching my toddler boy play with firecrackers and a lighter. He's so crazy its entertaining till we all go boom!
The tax exempt status wouldn't be needed, and for appearances the non-exempt challenge would probably have a better global showing because there is not an ulterior motive the various religions foist upon the world.
Besides, you lose me on the organized part of it. I don't organize. I prefer the disorganized plethora of problems that quite naturally characterize the human race. Organizing that is always contrived and never actually serves much of a purpose unless war is the focus.
Let's use the profit for the Atheist State lol
"atheist religion" - I don't feel comfortable when you say that.
Endri
Yes it's an oxymoron. Most atheist I think feel the same way, as do I. It isn't fair to good atheists who are being discriminated against our opposing belief. We are being treated like a religion by foolish people. Trying to think of a creative way to beat religion at its own game.
I don't think anyone should attempt to beat them at their own game. It only perpetuates the playing of it.
@CyberLN
Just as taking all the money of someone who is gambling away their lives will not stop them from gambling.
That's a good point. What are some good alternatives in your opinion?
An interesting thought to me comes out of this.
Various religions have been beating other religions in their own game for thousands of years. The religions that push spreading their religion beats out the religions that do not. The religions that allowed for their people to have scientific discovery beat out the religions that do not through conquest. (The balance of power for nearly all war comes frequently down to a new scientific discovery that gave a particular group a powerful advantage over the opposing side.) The religions that highly radicalized their followers to follow any command, including strapping bombs to their body and wading into crowded areas have more success than religions that do not.
The succesful religions today are the ones that most embraced spreading of their ideals, and using new tools of war inventions to successfully carry this out, and for some, radicalizing their followers.
However for the first time in our long history of war, people are not needed nearly as much to carry out war. With drones and other machines of war, where one person can control an entire fleet of highly effective fighting machines. War is already changing greatly. The concept of armies of people invading foreign lands is quickly becoming history. When is the last time we seen a first world country invaded by a standing army of another country? WW2 nearly 70 years ago now?
Because of this, does that mean at least the conquest component of major religions in 1st world countries is now over? We are left with just those that push their religion the most and those that radicalize their followers the most? Progress on one front at least.
CyberLn
Good point. I'm going to use that line some day:) I hate religion. I'm over the idea of making atheism a religion. Thank you to all who offered your logical advice.