Customers only rest room - muh racism.

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Sushisnake's picture
@TermDog

@TermDog

Re: "Yeah Starbucks is known the world over as a hang out for white supremecist Nazis."

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Cognostic's picture
I grew up in a small beach

I grew up in a small beach tourist town. There were public bathrooms at the beach and several places in the city. You did not go into a business to use a toilet. The gas stations would not even give you a key unless you were a customer. If you tried to go into a store or restaurant you would be told, "The public bathrooms are up the street."

This is what I found "To avoid being arbitrary, there must be a reason for refusing service and you must be consistent. There could be a dress code to maintain a sense of decorum, or fire code restrictions on how many people can be in your place of business at one time, or a policy related to the health and safety of your customers and employees. But you can’t just randomly refuse service to someone because you don’t like the way they look or dress."

So, not purchasing is a valid reason to have someone leave the building. That just makes sense. HOWEVER: If as you have said, the rule is not being enforced consistently. then I agree there is a problem. No one should be targeted. The rule should apply to everyone or no one but being random is not allowed.

On this point I will soften my position. Restaurants and other public facilities do have the right to set policies on who they will serve. (No uniformed police, has been a new one that cropped up recently. Completely legal.) Bathrooms are for customers only is something I grew up with and completely understand as a part of what is normal. Inconsistency on the other hand, does look like discrimination. Rules can not be enforced randomly.

Terminal Dogma's picture
You have to look at patterns

You have to look at patterns of behavior, Starbucks is the most libcuck safe space on the planet. To try frame them as racist is as funny as it is pathetic.

Go have your for profit real estate meeting at your own expense.

Shameless these "victims" didn't just leave when they were politely asked, attention whoring or trying to cash in on the race card.

turning_left's picture
"You have to look at patterns

"You have to look at patterns of behavior, Starbucks is the most libcuck safe space on the planet. To try frame them as racist is as funny as it is pathetic."

Though this was clearly a racist event (see all of the articles referenced by those before me), I haven't personally read of anyone claiming that Starbucks itself is a racist company. I also haven't heard a single person in my liberal community make that claim. Starbucks recognized that their policies left room for guests to be treated differently based on race, resulting in the decision to change those policies so that racial discrimination couldn't happen in that way. I'm not seeing what there is to mock in that.

"Shameless these "victims" didn't just leave when they were politely asked, attention whoring or trying to cash in on the race card."

Gee, if those black men sitting at the counter or the black woman at the front of the bus had just left when asked, everything would have been fine. Such attention whores.

Terminal Dogma's picture
No this wasn't clearly a

No this wasn't clearly a racist event in spite of someone inserting links you didn't read.

You are disgusting comparing this event to civil rights apartheid resistance on buses....that is really degrading and disgusting.

turning_left's picture
We obviously see this

We obviously see this completely differently and I was silly to engage. My apologies if you were offended. I deeply respect those who peacefully protest racism.

Terminal Dogma's picture
K, gonna fess up here. If I

K, gonna fess up here. If I go to someone's place for a dinner date I try to to control my bowels so I don't have to shit up their place.

Cognostic's picture
Sequence of events.

Sequence of events.
The men were sitting there doing nothing (Agreed) They were not arrested for this.
Note - no one was bugging them. No one said anything to them. Everything is fine. They are doing exactly what other people are doing with no issue at all.

The men then requested to use the bathroom.
They were told the bathrooms were for paying customers only.
The men said "no." They wanted to use the bathroom.
At that point they were trespassed. "Completely Legal" They violated Starbuck's policy.
The police then arrived and talked to the men. Per the management .
The men were legally trespassed. (THEY WERE NOT CUSTOMERS) they did not follow policy.
The police asked the men several times to leave and the men refused.
As they had been trespassed by the management, the police did their job and took the men into custody. (The police did not walk up and slam handcuffs on the men. Everything done by the book) (Everything Legal)
The men were then arrested for refusing to leave. (No problem - that is the law.)

The issue is with the other customers and Starbucks employee's inconsistency. The issue was not about sitting in the Starbucks. The issue was about using the bathrooms as a non-paying customer. How long the other people had been sitting there or whether or not they had purchased anything is not the problem. Everything hinges, on what I have read, on whether or not other non-paying customers were allowed to use the bathrooms.

The men did not want to follow Starbucks policy and so they were asked to leave. If Starbucks is inconsistent in the enforcement of their policies and only target black men. I agree it is a problem. Restaurants; however, can set policies and expect them to be followed.

That's what I am seeing anyway. I think Starbucks should stand up for itself and its policy. UNLESS - other non-paying people who had purchased nothing were allowed to come and go into the bathrooms.

We will all have to wait for the court case as the two men try to sue Starbucks for discrimination. (Aw.... we won't see a thing. Starbucks will settle out of court.)

Sushisnake's picture
@Cog

@Cog

Re: " That's what I am seeing anyway. I think Starbucks should stand up for itself and its policy. UNLESS - other non-paying people who had purchased nothing were allowed to come and go into the bathrooms."

Starbucks would have lost if it went down that road.

I don't know if you saw my post on the preceding page, Cog, but I linked to an article by a middle aged white writer who regularly hangs out in Starbucks stores without buying anything - he says he wrote nearly an entire book in one. If Starbucks had decided to "stand up for itself", I'm certain the writer would have come forward and talked about all the Starbucks bathrooms he's visited without buying anything. He would have produced the video he talks about in the article, too- the one taken in a Starbucks in California a week after Philly where a black guy who hadn't ordered anything wasn't permitted to use the bathroom but a white guy who hadn't ordered anything either was permitted to use the bathroom- right in front of the black guy.

A law firm that knew how to do its job would have found these guys and god only knows how many more, and Starbucks most certainly would have been up against a law firm that knew how to do its job.  I think it was wise of Starbucks to settle out of court. $12 million might not have been enough to cleanse their reputation if it came out in court that shit like Philladelphia and Redondo Beach happen a lot.

The course they decided on - settling out of court, the racial sensitivity training- has not only enhanced their reputation, it appears to have lifted their share price back up, too. Starbucks have played this smart.

https://money.usnews.com/investing/stock-market-news/articles/2018-06-04...

 https://www.inc.com/bill-murphy-jr/i-heard-about-latest-starbucks-racism...

Terminal Dogma's picture
They already settled, got

They already settled, got full scholarship to do a degree as well + $12 million lost revenue to train staff + training costs. Training curriculum available on line for free courtesy of Starbucks.

Sushisnake's picture
@TermDog

@TermDog

Re: " They already settled, got full scholarship to do a degree as well..."

The scholarship's to help others- not themselves. 

"The two black men who were arrested while waiting in a Starbucks last month have reached an agreement with Philadelphia: The city will spend $200,000 to help young entrepreneurs.

And the men, Rashon Nelson and Donte Robinson, both 23, will each be given $1.

That is what they asked for when they approached city officials and agreed not to file a lawsuit against Philadelphia or its employees after they were arrested in an episode that ignited widespread criticism of Starbucks and the city’s police."

 https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/02/us/starbucks-arrest-philadelphia-sett...

Nobody knows what the Starbucks settlement is, was or will be- at Starbucks request.

Re: "  $12 million lost revenue to train staff + training costs"

Firstly, Starbucks revenues were US$29 billion last year, so I think they can afford it. Secondly, nobody forced Starbucks to do the training, they came up with it themselves- probably as damage control. I figure a multinational corporation worth $81.14 billion might have a bit of clue about what it's doing.

Terminal Dogma's picture
Starbucks race sensitivity

Starbucks race sensitivity trainin in action.

https://youtu.be/WuHmFkbuihc

Sky Pilot's picture
Well sometimes you just have
Terminal Dogma's picture
Not clicking on any of that,

Not clicking on any of that, you have a fetish or sumthing.

Sky Pilot's picture
Terminal Dogma,

Terminal Dogma,

"Not clicking on any of that, you have a fetish or sumthing."

I'm pointing out what will happen if businesses follow your idea. How many incidents would it take like that before a restaurant looses its customer base and goes out of business? The videos show that a broad spectrum of people are not afraid to use extreme measures when the mood strikes them, for whatever reason.

BTW, what did the guy do in the Starbucks incident to relieve himself since he couldn't use the facilities? Assuming that he really had to take a whiz I doubt is he could have held it until the cops let him do t at the police station. Now imagine if he had been in a really urgent situation. Would he have whipped it out and peed all over the restaurant in a fit of anger? Would that have been a good outcome for the store manager?

One day it will happen to you. What will you do?

Terminal Dogma's picture
Why don't you put your house

Why don't you put your house up for a public shitter.

Sky Pilot's picture
Terminal Dogma,

Terminal Dogma,

Denver streets are already public toilets =

"Denver Decriminalizes Public Defecation To Make Life Easier For Migrants, Homeless"
https://www.truthrevolt.org/news/denver-decriminalizes-public-defecation...

Just last month this 42 year-old NJ school superintendent got busted for repeatedly crapping on another high school track = "Serial Pooper At New Jersey High School Revealed To Be Superintendent".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a7C6e_LqXn8. His salary is $147,504 per year. So the guy would periodically get in his car and drive miles to the high school, go onto the track, and take some poops. He was caught in the act.

Terminal Dogma's picture
Liberals are turning the

Liberals are turning the entire world into a shit hole literally. Evolution will eventually make libtards extinct....Just have to contain the collateral damage and poop until it happens.

Sky Pilot's picture
Terminal Dogma,

Terminal Dogma,

"Evolution will eventually make libtards extinct...."

What's your version of the ideal world? According to the Mormon fairy tale each good Mormon guy will become a God with his own world and harem. So maybe if you become a good Mormon you will get your own world and make it just perfect without any libtards. It's that a great plan?

Terminal Dogma's picture
@dio, not sure what you mean

@dio, not sure what you mean by a perfect world. The only world I know of is this one or a you just fantasizing?

Is this world perfect - I guess in the absence of other worlds it sorta, kinda is.

Sky Pilot's picture
Terminal Dogma,

Terminal Dogma,

"@dio, not sure what you mean by a perfect world."

I said that if you were the God of your own planet that you could make it perfect. So it would be perfect by your godly standards even if other people and gods thought that it was the crappiest place in the universe.

Consider, since you don't want people to use the lavatories in businesses unless they are customers maybe you could design the people on your world where they didn't have to defecate or urinate. Some people think that this world isn't perfect because people can't regrow lost limbs. On your world maybe they could.

Sky Pilot's picture
If you're in Australia and

If you're in Australia and need to use the toilet at McDonald's you have to buy something in order to get a receipt with the code to the toilet lock.

"McDonald's bathroom where you need to pay before you pee has some customers seeing red"

"There are parts of France, Germany, Singapore and Turkey, just to name a few, where the practice is commonplace.

So when McDonald's customers on Queensland's Sunshine Coast learned they could only access the bathroom through a code given out once they've ordered, it was met with a mixed response.

A photo of a sign outside the door leading to the men's, women's, and disability toilets at the Maroochydore restaurant sparked fierce discussion on social media this week."

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-06-08/mcdonalds-requiring-receipt-barcod...

What do you do if you need to wash your dirty hands before eating? Do you take your food into the toilet with you or do you leave it unattended on a table?

If you are at a car dealership will you have to buy a car before you can use the toilet?

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