ETHICALISM: Atheism: Reject all gods and all religions.
ANIMISM: Matheism: Accept all gods and all religions.
THEISM: Islam: Accept Torah and Bible, and reject all gods and all religions.
How does the Quran make all gods same god?
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Through the interpretation methodology:
We (Sunnatullah) are responsible for its interpretation. (Quran 75:19)
WHEREAS: Sunnatullah means The Ways of Allah or The Law of Nature.
Nature is always logical in everything it does and self-preservation is the first law of nature. Accordingly, logic is responsible for its interpretation and for the self-preservation of natural order. Eco + Logic.
Allah is the LordLaw of the Universe (Eco + Logic). (Quran 1:2)
What does it mean to believe in the Quran?
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But as for those who have clear evidence from their LordLaw (of Nature) followed up by a witness from Him (Natural Person) and before it the ordain of Musa came as a model and a mercy (for Tawba, ie. align our nature with NATURE, 7:156-157: Natural Law) — such people have iman in it (Quran). Any faction which rejects it is promised the Fire. Be in no doubt about it. It is the Truth from your Lord. But most people have no iman. (Quran 11:17)
Conclusion:
IF
1. Have iman in Law of Nature (Believe in Metaphysics, What is Reality? MATH)
2. Have iman in Natural Person (Believe in Epistemology, What is Knowledge? E)
3. Have iman in Natural Law (Believe in Axiology, What is Value? ISM)
THEN have iman / read the Quran
ELSE have no iman / not read the Quran
The above is Philosophy (Love of Wisdom)
The Arabs (Jurisprudence : Al-aAArabu) are the worst in rejection and hypocrisy, and more likely not to know "Islam". (Quran 9:97)
He made all gods same god. (Quran 38:15)
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Accordingly, all religious and non-religious texts must be interpreted through:
1. Law of Nature (The belief in Metaphysics, What is Reality? MATH)
2. Natural Person (The belief in Epistemology, What is Knowledge? E)
3. Natural Law (The belief in Axiology, What is Value? ISM)
and before it can VALID/LAWFUL.
Objective
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Do not corrupt the earth after it has been put right. (Quran 7:56)
(take only what you need and leave the land as you found it)
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You are heavily quoting the Quran. Why should I accept anything it says as true?
For example, I have seven books that describe a secret society of wizards. Objectively, why should I accept the Quran as more correct than Harry Potter?
The issue you raise does not answer "What is Truth"?
I belong to the Quranic Animism, and have no problem to accept the comic book as Truth, provided:
Validity + Truth = Soundness
I wasn't attempting to answer "What is truth"
I also wasn't asking why you accept the Quran as true.
I was asking why any of us should accept it as true.
I'll ask again. Why should I believe anything the Quran says? If you are going to use verses from this book in order to make an argument, you MUST provide SOMETHING that indicates it should be believed.
No one asking you to believe in anything the Quran says.
Do not follow blindly what you do not know to be true: ears, eyes, and heart, you will be questioned about all these. (Quran 27:36)
AND read the first post on what it means to believe in the Quran.
What you said on your first post about believing the Quran is a quote from the Quran.
If you are not interested in showing why the Quran should be believed, then it follows that rational people will reject anything that comes from it.
I reject everything you have claimed through quotes from the Quran as untested, unproven, and untrue.
Nope. then it follows that rational people should verify anything that comes from it.
Skeptical Kevin #I reject everything you have claimed through quotes from the Quran as untested, unproven, and untrue.
Of course, that's what religious people and bigots do. Everything is untested, unproven, and untrue; Official Definition of Atheism.
But not in Matheism, I even quote Lord Ganesha.
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You don't seem to understand the burden of proof. The burden is on the person making the claim, in this post that is you. I am not saying Allah is this that or the other thing. You are. It is not incumbent upon me to verify your claims.
If I claim that my neighbor has a pet dragon, it is not up to you to say "Maybe that's true, I guess I have to make a trip to Kevin's house to see if there's a dragon there." No. It is up to me to provide evidence.
You can tell me the burden is on me to verify your claims until you are blue in the face, but that does not make it so.
You can call me a bigot all day if it helps you feel better. But refusing to accept unproven claims doesn't make me a bigot. It makes me rational.
What is the verse that you don't agree from this thread?
Show me.
Very well, please demonstrate these are true:
He made all gods same god. (Quran 38:5)
We (Sunnatullah) are responsible for its interpretation. (Quran 75:19)
Allah is the LordLaw of the Universe
(Quran 1:2)
Any faction which rejects it is promised the Fire. Be in no doubt about it. It is the Truth from your Lord. But most people have no iman. (Quran 11:17)
The Arabs are the worst in rejection and hypocrisy, and more likely not to know "Islam". (Quran 9:97)
@ matheist
Qu'ranic Animism. What a joke. You do realize the two are completely apathetic to each don't you? You are either an Animist, which has NOTHING to do with the Qu'ran/Islam, or, you are an Islamaboob. Can't be both.
Read these words again: “Do not follow blindly what you do not know to be true”
You do realize the Qu'ran was plagiarized from the Jewish Torah? The Jewish Torah was plagiarized from the many myths and legends of Sumerian Empire, many of those myths and legends thousands of years older?
THEREFORE: There is not word of truth within the Qu'ran.
All verses in all religious texts.
rmfr
Why would a God need to point out that there are no other gods?
Because all other gods are not Energy.
1. Energy (Allah) cannot be created.
2. Energy (Allah) cannot be destroyed.
3. Energy (Allah) can be transformed.
4. All other gods / things are the transformation of Energy.
I agree with Skeptical Kevin
This is an atheist forum. To assume that the quran is taken more seriously than toilet paper is borderline. So quoting that crap is a complete waste of time.
That is Hasty Generalization, ie. Religion.
+ this is a debate section for Islam.
Then take this thread to a fucking Islamic forum.
If you are aware, this is an atheist forum. If you really want to discuss Islam, then prepare for some very difficult answers.
All you are doing is exercising circular reasoning, where the quran is proof of allah because the quran says so.
Spot on!
Quoting anything from an unproven book is akin to saying, "my mate reckons...."
It holds no weight.
How does your argument relevant for the issue
Validity + Truth = Soundness?
I suppose the same as yours.
You are trying to hijack physics and slide in the 'god card' to wherever is convenient to you.
Can you provide any pier review data to demonstrate the validity that there is an 'Allah'?
You agree Energy exists. That is the proof.
Please provide pier review papers to back this claim.
You are simply re-labelling a phenomena that already exists.
"YOU AGREE" Energy exists.
What's wrong with your logic? (Quran 68:35)
Yes, of course.
Now, this is testable, empirical and well known by physics.
Provide just one pier review paper regarding Allah in any way linked to energy.
We're waiting.
That is bigotry issue.
I can call energy in any language I like.
What is that a problem for you?
@Matheist
Oh bluhddy fookin' hell! This same ol' quran and islam bullshit AGAIN?... *shaking head sadly*... Ya know what? As far as I am concerned, your precious quran and islamic dogma can both shove a giant dildo up their ass and twerk on it. (And I mean that in the nicest possible way... *fake smile*...) But, hey, since you seem so obsessed with Energy Gods, try this on for size...
The Force is energy. The Divine Master Yoda himself encourages His faithful followers to use The Force. Master Yoda sent His supreme Prophet Obi Wan out unto the desolate world of Tatooine so that he should spread the glorious news of The Force to all of His faithful children who were being led astray by the sinister evill of The Dark Side that was controlled by the Sith Lord Vader.
So it came to pass it was on Tatooine where Prophet Obi Wan did encounter Disciple Skywalker, a rebelious and undisciplined young man of lofty dreams. And, lo, Prophet Obi Wan did share with Disciple Skywalker the wonderful news of The Force as given unto to him through the infinite wisdom of Divine Master Yoda.
And young Disciple Skywalker did learn of the ways of The Force, and The Force became strong within him. Until it came to pass after many battles across many worlds, Disciple Skywalker did confront the Sith Lord Vader in immortal combat among the eternal stars. And such is the supreme goodness of The Force, the Sith Lord Vader was thusly defeated by young Disciple Skywalker. And varily I say unto thee that the Sith Lord Vader did denounce his love for The Dark Side upon his defeat. Amen.
See? Just as plausible as your islam... *merrily skips away*...
Equally plausible, but objectively better because there are lightsabers. *grin*
You can watch Star Wars for at least a few minutes without it contradicting itself, so it has that going for it.
@Tinman,
Jeez, how about a spoiler alert, huh?
Just for that, I'm letting you know that you are only a figment of Dorothy's dream and therefore I have no idea where you've really been putting all that WD40.
@Tinman & @NewSkeptic, I feel like this Penny Arcade is appropriate :D
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I really think this Allah ha ha ha, is an excellent example of failure to be able to reason, due to religious cognitive bias.
Hey Matheist,
You wrote this:
and this:
and then this:
So, I think I'm right to assume that you equate Energy with Allah. Same thing just a different name?
Well, let me point out just a few differences:
1. Energy is a physics concept, an abstract scalar quantity associated with motion (kinetic energy) or arrangement (potential energy). Energy is not measured, it is computed. It is verifiable, tested and true. Allah, on the other hand, is an invention of old, insecure men, with small dicks and shriveled balls (hence insecurity), to fool, terrorize and subjugate others.
2. Energy does not command the followers to kill the ones that do not believe in it. Your Allah does implore the faithful to kill apostates.
3. Energy does not care which hand you use to wipe your ass and with which hand you eat. Your Allah cares about stupid and insignificant details like that.
4. Energy does not teach that fresh and salt water do not mix. Your Allah does (I guess that the old men with small dicks and shriveled balls didn't know anything about the Estuarine Science back then and invented shit left and right)
5. Energy does not give anybody the right to fuck underaged girls. Your Allah does, otherwise the self proclaimed prophet Muhammad wouldn't dare to rape twelve years old girl.
6. Energy does not hold a grudge against pigs. Your Allah does (poor pig)
You see where I'm going with it?
So, quoting you: