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The causality you see in your daily life is just an artifact of a huge amount of averaging. As the number of particles involved in something skyrockets; the probability of getting the expectation value typically approaches 1.
Because at that point it is akin to asking what is north of the north pole.
Furthermore, quantum mechanics still deal with the physical. We just have not come to a full understanding. But we have top specialists working on it.
rmfr
NO IT DOESN'T "causality still takes place in the macroscopic realm." THAT IS THE FUCKING PROBLEM WE CAN;T FIGURE OUT. Would you please read a frigging book before making your next comment. PHYSICS BREAKS DOWN AT PLANCK TIME.
"But that simple causal structure of everyday life can break down in the quantum realm. Recent research reveals that causal relationships can be placed in quantum superposition states in which A influences B and B influences A. In other words, one cannot say if the toppling of the last quantum domino is either the result of the first domino’s fall or its cause. The emerging subject of indefinite causality in a quantum world may provide new insights into the theoretical foundations of quantum physics and general relativity."
https://physicstoday.scitation.org/do/10.1063/PT.6.1.20180328a/full/
This is just pushing the problem further. Why does quantum physics behave this way, instead of any other possible way? What determines the nature of quantum physics?
Troll! This is so Old by now.
Your argument can be logically sound but the facts are the facts.
Translation: I deny this.
Hum... No. What was the point of the Michelson-Morley experience?
Edit
No one needs to dismiss the supernatural by default. You need to cite exactly what you mean by supernatural and demonstrate that it exists. Supernatural appears to be a synonym for "I'm a dumbshit and don't know what the fuck I am thinking about. " Start your own thread and prove something called the supernatural is real. I would love to see it. Or just sit back here and make inane ignorant assertions and pretend you are somehow smarter than the average moron.
You have absolutely no intention to understand what position I'm taking, right? It seems like you don't even want to debate at all. Calling people stupid doesn't make them stupid; and even if it does it still proves nothing. Average moron.
There you go again. It's not our fault you make idiotic comments with inane assertions. You are the one asserting something called "supernatural" exists. PROVE IT! You prove it and I will happily and sincerely apologize.
JazzTheist: "You have absolutely no intention to understand what position I'm taking, right?"
Not unless you can provide OBJECTIVE HARD EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE. Onus probandi incumbit ei qui dicit non ei qui negat.
JazzTheist: "Calling people stupid doesn't make them stupid; and even if it does it still proves nothing. Average moron."
OK. I won't call you stupid, Below Average Moron. ;-P
rmfr
Troll - more BS assertions without evidence.
A Theist's Logic For ALL Phenomena:
I, [insert name], am incapable of understanding how [insert phenomena] could have happened. Thus, [chosen deity] must have done it. — Arakish
Or, as Cognostic put it, "I'm a dumbshit and don't know what the fuck I am thinking about."
rmfr
Wow. Just...wow.
I have NEVER, EVER, seen a better example of a straw man.
And it doesn't cease to be a straw man just because you deny it.
Then prove these are straw man.
Religious Logic ALL Phenomena: I, [insert name], am incapable of understanding how [insert phenomena] could have happened. Thus, [chosen deity] must have done it. — Arakish
When one person suffers from a delusion, it is called insanity.
When many people suffer from a delusion, it is called religion.
Daffynition of Religious Absolutists: Knowing the facts, seeing the facts, but still believing the lies. — Arakish
rmfr
Is it a straw-man, quite possibly...
Is it an opinion based on the bollocks that's usually posted on here by those of a theistic persuasion?
Undeniably!
Go through thread after thread, after thread... and you can never pin a single one down to give straight answers, they tend to weasel their way out, refuse to answer or answer a question with another question.
I've personally lost count of how many times I've asked theists to just demonstrate one causal link that leads to supernatural phenomena.
E.g. homo-sapiens - evolving from primate ancestor(natural phenomena), evolve from simple life via regression over huge spans of time (natural phenomena), how the earth formed (natural phenomena) how our solar system formed(natural phenomena)... all the way to the big bang...
Everything appears to follow the same pattern and model, but please feel free to demonstrate where a supernatural explanation fits in anywhere and offers a better explanation of the data.
Here's one. Existence. And that's all you ever need.
Go through thread after thread after thread and you'll find that nobody has refused to answer me as well, and just resorted to denial.
JazzTheist: "Go through thread after thread after thread and you'll find that nobody has refused to answer me as well, and just resorted to denial."
Need I say more?
rmfr
Wrongly posted*
No one has 'DENIED' anything. Post after post simply asks you for EVIDENCE of you frigging inane assertions. Your ignorance takes stupidity to a new all time low. Have you thought of remedial reading classes?
You ARE denying things by asking physical evidence for non-physical things. Your stubbornness takes hostility to a new all time high. What's more, you been ignoring my arguments and insulting me and my parents. As such, every argument that you'll ever make in the future will be considered rubbish by default; because you've disqualified yourself as a serious debater.
And yet, you still put fourth controversial postulates that cannot be verified, proven, tested etc. and expect to be taken seriously.
Do you not see the problem here?
You was asked to demonstrate a causal link to the supernatural and you said 'existance', how do you get to there?
You may claim a first cause, but what was the first effect? and how could something supernatural interact with the natural?
I would suggest you offer more meat to your assertions so that people can have a serious conversation.
@JazzTheist
"You ARE denying things by asking physical evidence for non-physical things."
Ding ding ding, don't you get it? Non-physical things are just products of the imagination and are not real?
Hello? In case you missed the point, NOT REAL
Elaborate on that, i would like to see how we get to that conclusion.
Existence itself needs a source. In other words, everything that exists exists for a reason.
And that ''reason'' needs to be separate from existence itself, since existence cannot be responsible for itself. Therefore, the ''reason'' is supernatural.
And to be clear, the ''reason'' is definitely not a bearded Caucasian man wearing a cone heat.
Why does it need a source? Why must it be supernatural?
If we are good Bayesians we have to assume given that everything before was natural the precursor should be too.
There is zero evidence or data for the supernatural, it cannot even be described...
It's actually on a par with describing exact 'nothing'.
The evidence is heavily against it.
This is getting dangerously near a god of the gaps argument.
''Why does it need a source?''
Because it is contingent. In fact everything is contingent.
''Why must it be supernatural?''
Because it would have to be separate from existence, which would make it supernatural.
''There is zero evidence or data for the supernatural...''
Existence itself is the evidence. Yes, I know...not according to the naturalistic worldview, which dismisses the supernatural by default. The problem is that the methodology would never, ever grant the possibility of the supernatural. Sounds unfalsifiable to me.
@ Breezy (posing as JazzTheist)
Provide OBJECTIVE HARD EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE that "contingent" MUST have a "cause/source."
Else, The Six Razors:
rmfr
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