Is There No Limit to Theistic Ignorance?

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Cognostic's picture
Is There No Limit to Theistic Ignorance?

I read this shit and my jaw dropped. How can theists be this ignorant?

"Here are some things that empirical evidence cannot be provided for.
I am sure you use or believe in these.
Logic
Reasoning
Ethics
Morals
History (you can’t directly observe it, smell it, or perform test on it)
The Future
I agree that empiricism is a great tool, but should it be our only tool?
Is it applicable to everything?"

If empiricism is a great tool, why in the hell don't more theists use it?

*Logic is completely empirical. It works. It is demonstrable. It is repeatable. It is the structure behind all effective reasoning, ethics, and morality. Morality without logic is a Theistic Dictate.

*History? Do theists have a fucking clue what the word "History" means or how we explore it. Do you imagine we just make it up? History is completely empirical.

This is some of the most ignorant garbage I have ever seen on the site.

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Grinseed's picture
Ummmm...link? And one of

Ummmm...link? And one of those phallic cookies while you're at it, thanks.

Tin-Man's picture
@Grin Re: "Ummmm...link?"

@Grin Re: "Ummmm...link?"

Page 2 in the "Where are the arguments for God" thread. It should be no surprise when you see who the theistic poster is... *chuckle*...

David Killens's picture
One syllable, zero brain

One syllable, zero brain activity.

Grinseed's picture
Thanks Tin, without looking,

Thanks Tin, without looking, I think I can guess. But I only asked in the first place to get one of those cookies.

Tin-Man's picture
@Grin

@Grin

In case you haven't noticed, some of those particular cookies are self-flossing, depending on the grooming standards of the chef.

Grinseed's picture
@Tin

@Tin
I did guess the right theist. Its true, each has his/her own distinctive style.

I deserve a cookie just for that, but be aware I only use the cookies to attract flies which are far juicier and have more protein which is good for you.
I'll share some with you. Squawk.

Cognostic's picture
I'm trying not to put down

I'm trying not to put down any one individual but have not seen nonsense as overt as this in all the time I have been on the site. I mean, there is nonsense and then there is nonsense. I'm just chalking it up to Home Schooling.

xenoview's picture
Someone is passing out

Someone is passing out cookies? I want one.

Tin-Man's picture
@Xeno Re: Cookies

@Xeno Re: Cookies

Check with Cog. Careful what you ask for, though.

Cognostic's picture
Okay Okay, Help yourself...

Okay Okay, Help yourself...

Attachments

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Yes
Grinseed's picture
Thanks Cog. You the pan

Thanks Cog. You the pan troglodyte!
Flies anyone?

Algebe's picture
It's a long time since I

It's a long time since I studied philosophy, but my recollection is that knowledge derived through logic is a priori. It doesn't depend on other knowledge. For example, if x is always greater than 3, x can never be 2.

Empirical knowledge is a posteriori. It comes after observations and experience. And we can use logic to derive additional knowledge from it. My cookie jar is empty. Your fingerprints on the jar. Therefore you ate my cookies.

No religion has ever provided empirical evidence for their claims. So they try desperately to cobble together fake a priori knowledge, such as the nonsensical arguments of Kalam, Anselm, and Aquinas. That's because a priori is the end of the road. You can't argue past it.

I think morals are mostly empirical. We have instincts as social apes, but our moral sense is really formed as we experience the existence of others and their reactions to our behavior. However, morality also has a logical component. The Golden Rule expressed by Confucius, Buddha, Jesus, and my mother is logical morality.

History is a minefield. It can be highly subjective. Who wore the black hats and white hats in World War II? Who started it? Every bit of evidence has to be weighed and interpreted, and our interpretations are colored by our backgrounds. I grew up in the Cold War, so I'm biased against Russia and China and in favor of America, Britain, Europe, and Japan.

What we really need from history today is an objective analysis of the role played by religion in every conflict in the past four millennia. And on that basis we need to print up some warning labels to be attached to every religious book in the world.

Cognostic's picture
@Algebe: HISTORY: The

@Algebe: HISTORY: The interpretation of history can be a minefield. It is interpreting the empirical facts wherein the problems occur. No historian worth his shit is going to make claims without empirical backing.

Logic: agreed and if it were not for empirical validation it would be useless. An apriori that is unsupported can be rejected. Logic works. All the empirical evidence supports it.

Cognostic's picture
@Algebe: HISTORY: The

@Algebe: HISTORY: The interpretation of history can be a minefield. It is interpreting the empirical facts wherein the problems occur. No historian worth his shit is going to make claims without empirical backing.

Logic: agreed and if it were not for empirical validation it would be useless. An apriori that is unsupported can be rejected. Logic works. All the empirical evidence supports it.

Ricardo's picture
Was Jesus of Nazareth

Was Jesus of Nazareth Theistic?

Old man shouts at clouds's picture
See my reply to you on the

See my reply to you on the thread you posted this garbage.

Here's my answer as the other thread is getting overlong: :
"@ Ricardo

You said
Jesus of Nazareth was theistic.

There is no evidence that the Jesus (of Nazareth or the Nazarene) figure as described in the gospels ever existed; so your question is without foundation.

All the later stories of the Jesus figure are either hallucinatory (Paul) or plain storytelling (Mark and Luke), jewish propaganda (Matthew, but based on Mark anyway) or just plain fiction (John)

LostLocke's picture
Since it's unlikely he

Since it's unlikely he existed as an individual, distinct human, I'm going to say no.

Calilasseia's picture
Heh, the level of

Heh, the level of supernaturalist stupidity and duplicity I observe regularly on Facebook, pretty much establishes the neurotoxic effects of mythological adherence.

I'm still encountering on that medium, mindless trollbots who think "atheists think the universe came from nothing" constitutes some sort of killer "gotcha", instead of a repeatedly destroyed canard that those of us who paid attention in class can swat into the bin in our sleep. Then we have the "you think your granpda was a monkey" retarded gibberish from creationists who are clearly still in receipt of potty training from Mummy, and whose command of literacy is best described as "eats crayons", most of whom couldn't even spell "molecular phylogeny", let alone understand its foundational concepts.

The picture would not be complete, of course, without at least one instance of the "Hitler/Stalin/Mao were atheists" well poisoning garbage putting in an appearance from these specimens. One of said specimens in particular, being a lying sack of shit living in Australia, who upon further examination, revealed himself to be a fifth-rate Kent Hovind wannabee hick town preacher, who obviously has no no problem about lying for right-wing Jeebus. You can take it as read that the specimen in question is also a rampant Trumpoid, a racist throwback who appears to be harking back to the 1850s, not the 1950s, as his "golden era" in the past that only existed in the television in his head. I suspect it will only be a matter of time before this individual comes to the attention of law enforcement, and you can take your pick whether any future indictments against this individual involve tax fraud, money laundering, or playing "Hide the Sausage" with 12 year old girls.

This one is, I can tell, just itching to write his one way plane ticket to the American slave state fundagelical belt, where he will have a nice, lucratively gullible audience to be bilked, as was found by Ken Ham, another Antipodean religious schistosome, who found the pickings much riper in the land of polydactylous products of recursive genealogy.

Indeed, all too often, I find myself entertaining the darkly humorous thought, that any real, existing god type entity, if it happens to be sentient, is thinking to itself "Just exactly what did I do, to deserve being lumbered with these charlatans, liars and cretins queueing up to be my advocates?" I know for a fact that if I was occupying the "god chair", I wouldn't want any of these verminous and pestilential life forms stapling their monobrows to my mast, or soiling the decks of my ship with the shed secretions and pubic hairs they leave behind them when they're getting frisky with farm animals. I've observed prokaryotic life forms under the microscope with higher IQs, and encountered clouds of piss steam that possess more integrity.

If I was occupying that particular hot seat, I'd make fucking damn sure that I had the Nobel calibre people on my side, not the likes of Cardinal Pell or that Osteen money vampire. For that matter, if it were within my remit, I'd sort out the whole mess once and for all, by arranging for a pandemic to target selectively the morons and the criminals, while ensuring that the remaining Sagans and Curies of this world would be immune thereto. None of this stupid, primitive "global flood" shit for me, I'd choose an option that possessed surgical precision.

Old man shouts at clouds's picture
10,000 agrees to you Calli!

10,000 agrees to you Calli!

Tin-Man's picture
Once again, Cali nails it in

Once again, Cali nails it in his most unique and splendid manner. Bravo!... *clap-clap-clap-clap*...

Cognostic's picture
@Cali: Seriously, how in

@Cali: Seriously, how in the hell do you survive in this world?

Cali ordering a steak dinner at a steak house:

"Greetings pabulum server. I will be yare to injuctively authorize in precisely 10 minutes. "

*10 MINUTES PASS AND THE WAITER PROMPTLY APPEARS*

"Your prompt advent is acknowledged. I will commence with the calamari zakuski and a garden crisp vegetable infused salad. For an entree I will have a medium recherche steak with baked potato, chives, and sour cream. I also wish to imbibe, a nice glass of cabernet sauvignon."

I love you Cali but how in the hell do you function in the world?

Calilasseia's picture
If called upon to do so (and

If called upon to do so (and the appropriate fees are paid) I can be persuaded to speak as I write, though I would have to dress for the occasion ... something from Edmund Blackadder's wardrobe, circa the Regency, might be a suitable choice for this. :)

Usually, if given a choice, I prefer the written to the spoken word for dissemination of serious ideas, because speaking requires one to think "on the hoof", so to speak, whereas writing permits careful, considered deliberation by its very nature.

However, rest assured that I can conduct normal conversation. Posting here, on the other hand, provides me with the opportunity to keep my discoursive ordnance combat ready. :)

Pirate Jack's picture
Saw a fucking church sign

Saw a fucking church sign today that said “This is the year you see God clearly-2020.
Fucking hate churches!

Tin-Man's picture
PJ!!! Long time, no see! How

PJ!!! Long time, no see! How the hell ya been? Missed you on here, you swashbuckling bastard!

LogicFTW's picture
I would take that sign as a

I would take that sign as a bit of funny humour as an atheist.

I guess they assume I will get new glasses to restore my sight to 20/20

Sheldon's picture
@Cognostic

@Cognostic

To be fair, this is Jo we're talking about. Willful ignorance and dishonesty are the hallmarks of his posts since first came here. He's incorrigible as well, he'll never change as he doesn't care about what is true, only his blinkered pursuit of defending his blind faith based religious beliefs. He also has failed to show a shred of integrity since coming here. Quite deliberately in my opinion.

FreeAtLast's picture
As far as the title of thread

As far as the title of thread,a bit of a heads up.
If someone memorizes and comes at ya with all the verses for the Roman Road to Salvation, you know you got a hot theist on your hands, so BEWARE you are in for a fight!

Calilasseia's picture
Except that anyone bringing

Except that anyone bringing this drivel here is bringing a peashooter to a tank battle.

FreeAtLast's picture
Ahhh. But in the delusion

Ahhh. But in the delusion they see the peashooter as a nuke! (and usually abandon further discussion) In their mind, they always win and write you up as one of the deceived.

Very sad. They eat that David and Goliath myth up!

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