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Bringing you atheist articles and building active godless communities takes hundreds of hours and resources each month. If you find any joy or stimulation at Atheist Republic, please consider becoming a Supporting Member with a recurring monthly donation of your choosing, between a cup of tea and a good dinner.
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Bringing you atheist articles and building active godless communities takes hundreds of hours and resources each month. If you find any joy or stimulation at Atheist Republic, please consider becoming a Supporting Member with a recurring monthly donation of your choosing, between a cup of tea and a good dinner.
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You told us the plates where stolen; this article discusses the well known theft of pieces of paper (which supposedly were translations from the plates). Please provide a source to back up your claim that plates were stolen.
pulling out my dumb card real quick, totally messed up that part.
I should probably go to sleep or I am going to start messing stuff up more. It's just past midnight here and I kind of have school tomorrow and I'm already exhausted as it is.
wait, this is pretty embarrassing, I meant Martin Harris, not Oliver Cowdrey, they were both assistants to Joseph smith while he was translating.
oh, and the text on the plates was a degraded version of Egyptian, so I doubt anyone would have been able to read it.
Because if he didn't show them to the whole world; it would be harder to expose the fraud of a known/convicted fraudster?
I cannot confirm that he was telling the truth, but I believe that he was.
WHY is it that you believe him exactly? That is the ultimate question.
Because I have read the book of Mormon, I have read the testimonies of the eight witnesses, and the testimonies of the three witnesses. I have read the Doctrine and Covenants, and I have studied much of Joseph Smiths life. plus, not that you'll take this as a definitive answer, I have prayed about it quite a bit.
You believe the extra-ordinary claims of a convicted fraudster? That is some hardcore faith right there. I wouldn't have trusted Joseph Smith with a 2 day old tuna fish sandwich.
Do you believe that Galileo was wrong about the earth revolving around the sun? He was convicted of heresy and was sentenced to house arrest for the rest of his life. Do you believe that Einsteins beliefs were irrelevant because he was a Jew? He was hunted by the Germans during world war 2 but managed to get to the U.S. there are tons of examples of people who were prosecuted and charged with things they didn't actually do because of what they believed or said. I believe that Joseph Smith was one of those people. People told lies about him because they didn't like the attention he was getting and they didn't like that he was saying that what they were doing was wrong. Just because there was one time where he was found guilty doesn't get rid of all of the times he was arrested, held in basements during the winter, held in jail cells or threatened with his life and the lives of his family, when he was innocent.
From an outiside (non-USA) perspective, i really wonder why you people believe in this non sense. I have daily interactions with christians and muslims and i sort of know why they believe, or at least, how they were brainwashed to believe.
But you guys are just too recent and the lies are just too obvious. Golden plates, underwear and con men.
"Joseph Smith said that the angel had forbidden him to show the plates to anyone until they had been translated from their original "reformed Egyptian" language"
I mean come on, that's a smart man and an elaborate scheme.
If you want to belive in somthing, go to christianity, it's still insane but to a lesser degree than this.
I would like to note than no one here has ever heard of mormonism, they don't even know what it is. Not so divine after all.
Joseph Smith had the education of a 3rd grader when he translated the book of mormon. I would like you to read it and tell me that a third grader would have been capable of writing that. (there are many witnesses including people not affiliated with Joseph Smith that state that he did not have someone else write it for him) Joseph smith was once given the prophesy that his name would be loved and hated among all people, you are just helping that come true.
Oh no! Witnesses! Some rigorous impeccable evidence! Didn't he have a wife?
The logic of the book is that of a 3rd grader.
Everyone is hated and love, what kind of shitty prophecy is that.
The great majority of the world doesn't even know who joseph smith is.
@I am a mormon: Quiet, you were not going to convert anyone.
If I remember correctly, Mormonism is another of the many variants of Christianity, in several respects just as radical as evangelism and, largely, guilty of the so-called Midwestern bible belt in the United States, you know, the Mormon Trail; Illinois, Iowa, Nebraska, Wyoming, Utah.
If I'm honest, I haven't a different opinion about the Mormons than I could have about the Evangelists, Quakers, Catholics, Protestants, Muslims, Shiites, Sunnis, Sintoists... I'm atheist, I know that god doesn't exist, ergo, if god doesn't exist, religion is the most stupid thing a human being can say that practices. I don't know if I explain myself.
yes, I am not going to attempt to convert anyone.
Even if God doesn't exist (which he does) Mormons typically have a longer life span than other people because of the word of wisdom which we follow strictly. (we don't drink coffee or tea, we don't do drugs or drink alcohol, we don't swear, which usually prevents us from getting beat up) there are many benefits that come from living the kind of life that we do, even if you think we are stupid, I know that we aren't because I know that my God lives.
So if someone doesn't drink coffee or tea etc...
He's just as good as you guys, why need god then? Just search for every compound that has minor or major effect on life span and stay away from it. Tada! Who needs fairytails?
"God lives" beating heart and all? Sexual desire?
And how do you "know". Is it "faith"?
Faith (noun) : Believing in something without any evidence for it / in face or contradictory evidence.
Ex: I belive Joseph Smith was a great guy!
I know that my God lives, a major part of that is faith, yes, but I also know that he lives.
@I am a mormon: No, you don't know, believe isn't know.
@I am a mormon: No, you don't, belive isn't know. It's more, I know, yes, I know that god doesn't exist for a simple reason, it isn't necessary, and I can prove it.
And, of course, swear, or don't drink tea, or coffee, or to pray doesn't lengthen the life. This is a dietary and nutritional advice, drinking wine at meals and a wisky at night is good for tension, digestion, stomach, heart and lungs, and smoking marijuana before sleeping reduces more than ten percent the cancer risk, and if you smoke it marijuana contributes to fight the metastasis. There's nothing that's intrinsically evil, or good. For example, drinking more water than necessary produces calcium deposits that damage the kidneys, urethra, prostate, and urinary bladderand and raises the sodium level in the blood which increases the chances of absence episodes that affect neuronal regeneration and the creation of melanin, increasing the risk of senile dementia.
Nothing is black or white, everything is gray.
So Mormons live longer (how much longer?)...can you explain why the child suicide rate in Utah is almost double the national average? And the suicide rate in Utah has doubled since 2009. So I guess Mormons live longer...if they can make it out of their teens?
@ I am a mormon:
The tale of a man assisted by an angel who is staring into a hat and translating plates found in America attributed to a Middle Eastern culture is especially superstitious in the age of reason. I find your religion one of the silliest of all.
My view on Mormonism is pretty much the same as my view on any other religion.
I often let the dead speak for me:
All religions, with their gods, their demi-gods, and their prophets, their messiahs and their saints, were created by the prejudiced fancy of men who had not attained the full development and full possession of their faculties.
-- Mikhail Bakunin, 1871
In matters of religion it is very easy to deceive a man, and very hard to undeceive him.
-- Pierre Bayle, 1697
Honest investigation is utterly impossible within the pale of any church, for the reason, that if you think the church is right you will not investigate, and if you think it wrong, the church will investigate you.
-- Robert G. Ingersoll
I think as little about mormonism as I can. Ditto any other religion or cult
For myself...the salient points are that the Book of Mormon mentions horses ,cattle ,sheep ,goats ,swine , elephants ,barley ,wheat and silk. in pre Columbian America.
along with chariots ,wheeled vehicles ,iron ,steel ,metal swords and "cimiters".
IF there were even the smallest grain of truth in any of it then the archaeological record would have picked it up.......
they have not..... of the tribes mentioned in the book........ not a single trace....... any where .....nothing...... bupkis.
link:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archaeology_and_the_Book_of_Mormon#Modern_...
And as to "reformed Egyptian"....
"Klaus Baer, an Egyptologist at the University of Chicago, called the characters of the "Caractors" document nothing but "doodlings".
" in 1966, John A. Wilson, professor of Egyptology at the University of Chicago, wrote, "From time to time there are allegations that picture writing has been found in America .... In no case has a professional Egyptologist been able to recognize these characters as Egyptian hieroglyphs. From our standpoint there is no such language as 'reformed Egyptian'."
link...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reformed_Egyptian#Mormon_studies_of_reform...
so...for me at least.... "lies and gobbledegoop"......... just another deliberate fabrication purporting to be revelation.!!!
Okay, I am beginning to realize that you guys no longer want me here, therefore I will leave with you the entire articles of faith, which are memorized by most youth in the church
1 We believe in God, the Eternal Father, and in His Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost.
2 We believe that men will be punished for their own sins, and not for Adam’s transgression.
3 We believe that through the Atonement of Christ, all mankind may be saved, by obedience to the laws and ordinances of the Gospel.
4 We believe that the first principles and ordinances of the Gospel are: first, Faith in the Lord Jesus Christ; second, Repentance; third, Baptism by immersion for the remission of sins; fourth, Laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost.
5 We believe that a man must be called of God, by prophecy, and by the laying on of hands by those who are in authority, to preach the Gospel and administer in the ordinances thereof.
6 We believe in the same organization that existed in the Primitive Church, namely, apostles, prophets, pastors, teachers, evangelists, and so forth.
7 We believe in the gift of tongues, prophecy, revelation, visions, healing, interpretation of tongues, and so forth.
8 We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God.
9 We believe all that God has revealed, all that He does now reveal, and we believe that He will yet reveal many great and important things pertaining to the Kingdom of God.
10 We believe in the literal gathering of Israel and in the restoration of the Ten Tribes; that Zion (the New Jerusalem) will be built upon the American continent; that Christ will reign personally upon the earth; and, that the earth will be renewed and receive its paradisiacal glory.
11 We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may.
12 We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law.
13 We believe in being honest, true, chaste, benevolent, virtuous, and in doing good to all men; indeed, we may say that we follow the admonition of Paul—We believe all things, we hope all things, we have endured many things, and hope to be able to endure all things. If there is anything virtuous, lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy, we seek after these things.
If you managed to read all that, great.
finally I'm going to give my testimony that I know that my church is true, we do not deserve much of the persecution we get. The majority of our religion is devoted to serving others, which is why we have deseret industries, which introduces people to working life after being homeless or being in jail, it also allows poor people a source of cheap furniture and clothing. we also have bishops store houses which are non profit stores that give food to the needy for free (if you would like that you actually don't have to be LDS, but you do have to get a recommendation from a bishop stating that you actually need the food) We are also usually the first on scene to natural disasters to help the needy and give them shelter. I know our church may seem weird, but we are good people, even if some of you think our ancestors did bad things. I also know that Thomas S. Monson is a true prophet of God on the earth today.coming to the end of this, I know that if you ever become a little curious about the church, all you have to do is pray, with a true intent to know whether God lives and you will receive an answer. By true intent I mean you can't be looking to prove it wrong, if you are doing that you will receive no answer. Anyway, that's my testimony, take it for what it's worth. I am going to leave this site now and probably never come back cause my parents would freak if they saw me on it.
@I am a mormon: A silly question, Do you think that by writing all this nonsense is no longer a jerk? And don't make me do jokes about laying hands on my... c'mon, please.
I am mormon//
Even if God doesn't exist (which he does) Mormons typically have a longer life span than other people because of the word of wisdom which we follow strictly. (we don't drink coffee or tea, we don't do drugs or drink alcohol, we don't swear, which usually prevents us from getting beat up) there are many benefits that come from living the kind of life that we do, even if you think we are stupid, I know that we aren't because I know that my God lives.
Don't leave dude, stay I don't mind theists! Hate the belief not the believer!
lmao as far as I know Asians are the ones with the longest life expectancy and they, for the most part, are not Mormon kid. You are 17 and at that age I was looking for answers not asserting my "knowledge" of the unknown and of what can't be proven because faith does not require evidence or logic. To claim something as fact does, however, require evidence and logic. My use of profane language has never caused me any harm, they are my language enhancers. Makes everything much more passionate, man I fucking love you. lol
thank you, but I feel like other people don't want me here, I've been sworn at several times and I kind of don't like my religion being attacked on so many sides (I know, I should have thought of that before I came here).
@I am a mormon: I have no problem with you being here, but if you talk about religion and god, this is an atheist forum, and I personally will give you the octopus because your beliefs matter little to me. I don't know if I can explain myself.
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