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LogicFTW's picture
Did you even read what

Did you even read what happened?

The kid, pulled the fire alarm, and shot at kids as they poured into the hallways from their classrooms following a fire alarm drill. (They actually had a fire alarm drill earlier that day.) This shooter would not have been nearly as deadly if he tried to shoot at kids as they left/entered the school or were on the school bus and the police there were distracted investigating the fire alarm pull.

Besides, what are you even trying to say? We should beef up security on school busses and the area around the school entrances to safeguard students?

Sky Pilot's picture


What I'm saying is that if the school buildings become prisons then the potential shooter can easily get on the school bus in the morning, blast the driver, and kill everyone on the bus. In that case the death toll could be higher than if he had done the shooting in the school building.

Or suppose the shooter is a high school student and has a car. He drives into the school parking lot, gets his rifle out and start shooting. Of course he stands a good chance of getting killed by the cops but does he really care?

Some people want to arm teachers. What happens when a teacher wigs out and starts shooting the students? == Thoughts and prayers.

LogicFTW's picture
Was not saying schools become

Was not saying schools become prisons. Nor do I think securing all the entrances to all the nations schools is even remotely economically feasible.

Yes a shooter could easily walk onto a crowded bus and mow everyone down. Ofcourse if bus drivers only picked up students where they are supposed to be picked up, the killer student home address would be right nearby, making the shooter obvious. If the shooter does not care about getting caught, well then the game is up, nothing is safe, any place where 20 or more people gather in concentration is a target.

Driving to HS parking lot, I would certainly rather shooting to occur there then in school hallways. Students will be spread out, they could flee quickly in their cars, take shelter in their cars, (hide in their cars, preferably putting the engine block between them and the shooter if the shooter tries to fire at them, etc.

Definitely agree with you about arming of teachers. That is an incredibly stupid and ignorant idea, that would only result in many more school shootings and death. Probably even stupider idea then the wanna be cowboy that thinks bringing a gun in a dark and loud movie theater to "protect" themselves and be the "hero" is a good idea.

Daniel Wilson's picture
When reading the preamble of

When reading the preamble of the U.S. CONSTITUTION it seems clear to me that the govt. Is in the business of keep us safe and secure. The onus is clearly on the govt to create laws that protect us from threats foreign and domestic. Personally I believe that the founding fathers would be repulsed by they Carnage that is handed to us by the second amendment. Any CLEAR READ OF IT . Shows that it deals only with militias setup to rebel against tyranny of the state. It's obvious that they never had a thought of fellow citizens murdering each other the way we are. Perhaps they did think of it and let the govt. Come up with gun control laws on its own to protect us. That's what I believe they had in mind but it did not come to fruition. CLEAR and OBJECTIVE reading of the FIRST AMENDMENT shows me that the founders were great men with Goodwill and altruism in their hearts. Well, we know how far that went.....all I ask is for people to open their eyes and read these two amendments objectively and make a decision about the common sense need of gun control. All that being said, I am a sportsman, hunter and gun owner. Personally I do not believe semi auto assault rifles are needed in the general population, that's where the common sense decision about gun control heart goes out to all victims of this nation, the nation our founders wanted so many great things for. Common sense gun control is a must !!!

LogicFTW's picture
When they wrote the 2nd

When they wrote the 2nd amendment, the best gun you could buy, cost more than the typical house, took years of training to use properly, took forever to reload, could not fire very fast, prone to jamming or misfire or failure, and still even in the hands of the expert was not very accurate or deadly, (at least short term.)

Now a days you can buy a gun 2nd hand off the street for far less than a single room in the average house cost, have almost zero experience or training, and effectively mow down large amounts of people at once in a crowd. Can fire multiple rounds a second, not nearly as likely to fail, and can be reloaded in seconds with large magazines. 227 years have passed since the 2nd amendment was ratified, is it going to take another 227 years before people realize the 2nd amendment is hopelessly out of date?

Can you even begin to imagine what gun technology will be like by then? (Another 227 years from now,) probably something along the lines of: "Siri please kill person x, and wipe any trace of me being behind the kill command." And people want that to be legal to anyone that can afford to buy it because it is a "gun" and protected by the 2nd amendment?

Sky Pilot's picture


The purpose of the 2nd Amendment was to give the slave holders the authority and the means to suppress slave revolts through armed force. The States didn't have the means to do it and the Federal Government was too far removed from the source of potential conflict to be of immediate use. So they included the provision whereby the locals could quickly organize into an armed mob to kill the rebellious slaves.

The reason why so many people buy guns today is because they have been conditioned to believe that there will be a race war and they want to be armed in the event that happens so that they can kill black people. People who want to ban guns don't see such a conflict as a likely concern but a lot of the gun owners do. And when intruders break into their houses it reinforces their belief.

CyberLN's picture
Diotrephes, you wrote, “The

Diotrephes, you wrote, “The reason why so many people buy guns today is because they have been conditioned to believe that there will be a race war and they want to be armed in the event that happens so that they can kill black people. ”

I think you have inadvertently shown us more about yourself than you likely intended. “The reason so many people buy guns today...”. Which people? Who does it include? What color people?

LogicFTW's picture
I know quite a few gun owners

I know quite a few gun owners, and have heard their reasoning for owning guns, they all fall under: family/home/personal protection, and hunting.

Still a small sample size, I know, I certainly do not know any people living in rural Mississippi perhaps they think a race war is incoming, but I find it hard to believe that is the reason why so many people buy guns today.

Also the gun sales statistics seems to point more towards people buying guns because they fear they will lose their ability to buy guns. Gun sales boomed under Obama, and have declined greatly under the Trump (pro gun rights) administration. With several large US gun manufacturers near bankruptcy lately due to decline in sales. (Although with this school shooting, they will see another bump in sales as the gun nuts rush out to buy more guns in fear they will lose the ability to buy human killing machines.)

Sky Pilot's picture


Every State that has a right to bear arms in its Constitution specifies that it's an individual right.

mickron88's picture
that's what bloodbath vicious

that's what bloodbath vicious video games do to a kids mind...

poor thing..guidance from parents/guardians is still important here.

Sheldon's picture
There is no research linking

There is no research linking violent video games or television with real violent acts. It's worth noting that neither video games or television existed during two world wars, though of course one could claim those were anomalous to the general run of history, the fact is we are far less likely to meet a violent death than at any time in human history.

Daniel Wilson's picture
One of the many questions I

One of the many questions I have about this topic is:. Where is organized religion on this issue and why are they so silent about it.. if they are so pro life then why the silence,. Even when the massacres occur in their own building.... What's up with this???

mickron88's picture
they'll just say, "we'll just

they'll just say, "we'll just pray for their souls..its a good help if we all pray together, god will listen to us if were going to pray in a mob"

"say AMEN if you're blessed..ask WHY if you're not"

like Jesus did.."father why have you forsaken me?"

LogicFTW's picture
Don't forget most of them

Don't forget most of them believe that this life is a test and an eternity of paradise awaits them on the other side.

Greatest lie ever told in my humble opinion.

Sushisnake's picture


It’s nasty, too. " Accept the status quo. Don't expect or work for better for you and yours. Suffer in this life, justice in the next." Vile.

howejm3's picture
Chaplains from the Billy

Chaplains from the Billy Graham Evangelistic Association (BGEA) arrived in Parkland, Florida, within hours of Wednesday’s school shooting that killed at least 17 teens and faculty members.

algebe's picture
Those people have suffered

Those people have suffered enough, and now they have a bunch of smarmy, self-righteous, born-again bible salesmen telling them about god's mysterious plans and rewards in heaven.

Sheldon's picture
They never miss an

They never miss an opportunity to pick over the bones.

mykcob4's picture
So What jesus follower? All

So What jesus follower? All those assholes do is collect money speak in platitudes and make a spectacle out of public prayer and then endorse republicans that are bought and paid for by the NRA! How fucking christian of you. Christians are fucking hypocrites every last one of them!

Daniel Wilson's picture
When they care enough to do

When they care enough to do the very least!!!

Zaya Zahin's picture
Check it out . Freedom https:
mykcob4's picture

This is a blatant violation of the forum rules. You should be banned immediately. Oh, and BTW FUCK YOUR GOD, FUCK JESUS, FUCK CHRISTIANITY!

Old man shouts at clouds's picture
Its rubbish. Poorly written,

Its rubbish. Poorly written, badly reasoned and full of flaws.

Sheldon's picture
Quelle surprise. It's

Quelle surprise. It's complete woo woo, sentimental tosh, the most vapid painful to read flimflam. Excuse me while I go scrub my eyes with bleach.

algebe's picture

Your English is appallingly bad. Your thoughts are incoherent. And if you think you'll influence anyone on an atheist website with that trash, you're certifiable.

"Go peddle crazy someplace else." (Jack Nicholson in "As Good as it Gets").

bigbill's picture
Well guns are not the problem

Well guns are not the problem, you are falling for the lie that people with gun permits are violent!!! We have a right under the second amendment if we feel that is warranted to purchase a gun. It`s from our founding fathers. What you didn`t include was the mentally ill angle here. Normal law abiding citizens are not the problem here, but the person who is mentally incompetent. perhaps if some of the teachers would of been allowed to carry a fire arm possibly we never would have all 17 people dead I blame the law enforcement officials for this tragedy. The FBI field office in particular, because after being alerted they didn`t act on the tip they just didn`t follow up. You as a BIG LIBERAL PROGRESSIVE want to disarm all the law abiding citizenry. your against the constitution and what it stands for. Your have ruined the country.


Attach Image/Video?: 

mykcob4's picture

I served this nation and the Constitution honorably. You are wrong about the Constitution AND the Founding Fathers as usual.
The 2nd Amendment doesn't give you the right that you claim it does. You need to READ it and the Federalist papers that EXPLAIN IT!
BTW Nikolas Cruz was a religious white supremacist that bought his guns LEGALLY. In fact, He wasn't wanted for ANY crime before he committed his "christian" crime!
Just because the FBI is alerted doesn't mean they have the right to investigate. I am not defending their actions but you are ASSUMING a lot!
You make threats on the internet all the time. Should the FBI haul you in and take away your guns and lock you away I actually think that they should but they don't have probable cause to do so!

Sheldon's picture
Are you typing with your

Are you typing with your elbow?

Look Billy, guns are not the problem per se, but liberal gun laws and the attitude that these have fostered in many Americans, as your moronic diatribe amply demonstrates, are a problem. The evidence even before this latest tragic example is incontrovertible.

" I blame the law enforcement officials for this tragedy. The FBI field office in particular, because after being alerted they didn`t act on the tip they just didn`t follow up."

Really, are you sure? Bear in mind this was a citizen practising his second amendment right that you are so keen to champion. What exactly can the authorities do about it if he has broken no laws? You can't have it both ways, Billy.

" You as a BIG LIBERAL PROGRESSIVE want to disarm all the law abiding citizenry."

The boy who murdered those 17 children was a law abiding citizen, might it have been prudent to disarm him before this event? You just implied you wanted the FBI to do precisely this, but if he had the rights you are hysterically claiming must remain inviolate then they were powerless to act within the law. There is no evidence I am aware of that he had any diagnosed mental health issues, beyond committing mass murder, this then is the problem with your absurd post. If the FBI had taken this man's guns away before he'd committed this awful crimes you'd have been denouncing them for that. I have seldom encountered anyone as entirely devolved from reality and the ability to think rationally as your posts infer you are Billy.

Take this for example:

" your against the constitution and what it stands for. Your have ruined the country."

leaving aside the appalling spelling, and execrable grammar for a moment, you and only you have suggested post ad hoc that the authorities, namely the FBI, should have violated this man's 2nd amendment rights. The difference is that you are implying the authorities must guess who is going to commit crime before hand, whereas others are showing evidence that proves limiting availability of guns has been demonstrated to reduce this type of crime in many other countries.

You can't scream hysterically that everyone has the right to carry firearms and then rant at the authorities when inevitably someone uses them to commit crimes including violent mass murder. It's just so stupid it's hard not to believe you're simply trying to provoke a response.

bigbill's picture
Well the FBI acting on

Well the FBI acting on helpful tips from the public were able to stop such things from happening before.I could site the cases here in the USA alone that were foiled because the FBI were investigating. All of them in the Florida office should be fired!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It was not like the warning signs weren`t there the cops went to his house 39 times the neighbors called the cops he was thrown out of at least 3 schools. Do I have to list more warnings signs to you. Social media postings detail his dislikes, So misunderstanding me as usual here I`m not saying that the authorities should have violated his rights but they should have put a tail on him just like they do and did to other criminals. They should have been watching him. they completely failed an look what took place here.

LogicFTW's picture
I imagine you are against big

I imagine you are against big brother surveillance. The FBI tracking everything you write say and do. As you should be.

The FBI admitted to its error, taking the high road. But w/o big brother surveillance tools, you have to realize the FBI receives 1000's upon 1000's of tips everyday. 99.9% of them amount to nothing, the FBI simply does not have the resources to hunt down and follow up on every tip. The youtube video comment that was reported to them, they could not confidently tie to the eventual shooter, and even if they could, they can not add every single person they can verify on any comment board anywhere that says something along the lines of "I am going to shoot a bunch of people in a school." 99+ percent of the time, people that say something along these lines never actually do anything of the sort.

The FBI also stops many terrorist or mass shooting events from ever happening, but we rarely hear about those, where of course, the one time they mess up out of 1000, it is all over the news.


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