I don't know if a creator exists I hope not as I don't want a being constantly judging me for the actions I have caused and what I have said or physically affect my actions or thoughts but no one can truly physically prove or disprove the existence of a creator.
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Can you prove the tooth fairy doesn't exist? Same thing!
Ali,
"Can it be proven that a creator (god) does not exist"
It's not up to us to prove that a creator (god) does not exist. It's up to such a being to prove its existence to us. Not one such being has ever done that since the first con man created him. Everything that is happening and will happen has already been done countless times. No celestial deity of any kind has ever done anything godly in scope because such an entity does not exist.
Why do you need such an entity in your life?
@ mykcob4 I can prove that the tooth fairy doesn't exist as when I left my milk tooth that had fallen out all I had been left in the morning was a milk tooth
That isn't proof. And you don't have milk teeth just baby teeth.
@Ali Re: Tooth fairy
That does not prove the tooth fairy doesn't exist. Maybe the tooth fairy decided to skip your house that night. Maybe the tooth fairy already met his/her tooth quota before getting to your house. Maybe the tooth fairy simply did not like your teeth. (I've heard fairies can be very picky.) Anyway, point is, prove Thor isn't real. Prove Odin isn't real. Prove Zeus isn't real. Prove Aphrodite is not real. Prove the Easter Bunny is not real. AND prove the God in the bible is not real. A little hint: You cannot prove a negative. So, with that in mind, what makes you think the god in the bible is any more real than all the other thousands of gods and imaginary characters out there?
Tin-man,
"So, with that in mind, what makes you think the god in the bible is any more real than all the other thousands of gods and imaginary characters out there?"
The simple answer is that people love to believe in Jewish fairy tales. The Bible recognized that fact and warned people not to believe in such fairy tales. That's true regardless of ethnicity or culture. So everyone around the world from muslim Arabs to commie Chinese and Africans and Europeans and Americans swear by them because the fairy tale promises them eternal life free from pain and suffering.
As it says in Titus 1:14 (CEV) = "14 Don’t pay any attention to any of those senseless Jewish stories and human commands. These are made up by people who won’t obey the truth."
Now you will notice that the Bible doesn't say which ones are not senseless Jewish stories. The Bible is loaded with senseless stories from the first page to the last page. Which ones, if any, can be deemed to be sensible?
@ Diotrephes
And as we both know that Titus was not by"Paul" but was a wholly Roman invention to "romanify" i.e normalise Pauls existence and epistles that makes sense.
Old man shouts ...,
"And as we both know that Titus was not by "Paul" but was a wholly Roman invention to "romanify" i.e normalise Pauls existence and epistles that makes sense."
So are there any sensible Jewish stories in the Bible?
@ Diotrephes
By sensible you mean accurate, time consistent and without hyperbole? No. I think not.
"I can prove that the tooth fairy doesn't exist as when I left my milk tooth that had fallen out all I had been left in the morning was a milk tooth"
So when prayers to a deity are proved to not be answered what does that prove about that deity? You seem to be setting a double standard for what you term proof here. You also seem unaware that proof and evidence are not the same thing.
@ mykcob4 milk teeth are baby teeth it's just another name used for them
@Ali....
Which particular creator God are you referring to ...?
If ,as I suspect, if it is Allah ,then you need to chase down the history of this deity.....
as I understand it Allah was merely one of the 350 odd idols housed at the Kabah in Mecca in pre Islamic Arabia.... he had 3 daughters (the three cranes) Al'Uzza ,Allat and Manat.... some myths refer to Hubal as a son of Allah ....
but I'm sure a little digging will give you enough to disregard the Allah character.
Hope this helps..
Regardless of whether a creator exists, a being does not automatically have a moral authority to judge you. You should be more worried about whether you follow your own morality.
No.
Nor that it does exist.
I can't prove that Sauron doesn't exist. Should I be worried that one day I'll wake up and Black Riders will be galloping through my town looking for "the halfling"?
No, because until someone can prove to me, at least to a reasonable extent, that Sauron *does* exist, I have no reason or basis to worry about it.
Same idea with Allah. Or Yahweh. Or Jehovah. Or Ra. Or Odin. Or Zeus.... see where this is going?
Ali, you are correct, no one can truly physically prove or disprove the existence of a creator.
But I do not claim any god does not exist, only that I have not been convinced one exists. I do not have to prove the non-existence of a god. In fact I never made that claim. But if you claim there is some god/supreme being, then you bear the burden of proof in convincing me.
"I can prove that the tooth fairy doesn't exist as when I left my milk tooth that had fallen out all I had been left in the morning was a milk tooth."
Last night I said a prayer for a million dollars. When I woke up, there was no million dollars.
So what?
If by "proof" you mean 100% then what is your point? You can't disprove the Easter Bunny with 100% certainty! That is hardly a reason to believe in the Easter Bunny.
I've never been a fan of the "You can't prove a negative" concept. Surely somebody out there can directly prove that square triangles don't exist, without having to hide behind the "lack of evidence" for their existence.
And, indeed, we can directly prove that square triangles don't exist! A clear proof (100%) is always required to establish a mathematical theorem.
In the world of atoms and energy you sometimes find cases where a lack of evidence is so unlikely as to rule out a claim beyond a reasonable doubt. Most of the time it is poor reasoning to rule something out because of a lack of evidence. It is also poor reasoning to claim something as true and not provide sufficient evidence. No rational mind is required to accept a claim that lacks sufficient evidence.
Greensnake,
"And, indeed, we can directly prove that square triangles don't exist!"
But two triangles can make a perfect square!
Diotrephes,
Arrrgh! Oh, wait! That's only because one triangle got turned around, clearly illegal!
Well yes, but that is partly because squares and triangles have very specific and very simple definitions. Once you start making unfalisifiable claims they can't by definition be falsified, and so the definition a believer attaches to their concept of a deity determines whether it can be falsified or not.
In science something is considered to be "not even wrong" when you can't even falsify it, it is also considered to be entirely useless of course, and unfalsifiable claims are unscientific by definition.
In my experience these arguments are a smokescreen some religious apologists trot out to deflect from the fact they can't demonstrate objective evidence for their beliefs.
"hide behind the "lack of evidence" for their existence."
Interesting and very disingenuous phrasing, I'm not sure why pointing out that a claim can't be evidenced is in any way hiding. And yet again since you seem determined to repeat this lie endlessly, rejecting a claim carries no burden of proof, and atheism is simply the lack of belief, so again why on earth would I believe something which no one can demonstrate proper evidence for? Do you believe Hercules was real and the supernatural claims made about him true? Can you 'prove' he wasn't and that the supernatural claims are not true?
Proofs only count in mathematics. You either believe something exists because you have evidence for it or you believe something exists because somebody told you to. Just like you can't prove there isn't a teacup in orbit around the sun or that I don't have an elephant in my pocket.
Why wouldn't you be able to disprove either of those things?
Well for starters, there is no way to eliminate the infinite number of cases.
What infinite number of cases? Just look in his pocket and you'll know if there's an elephant or not.
Fair enough, but this becomes infinitely more difficult when the search area is all of existence, which may be infinite. Say that there is a god, and he's in this universe somewhere, because why not? Now, assuming he has the power to move of his own volition, and his size is less than infinite, he would prove nearly impossible to find. By the time you search every single spot (which is already an impossibility, according to the definition of infinite), the bastard probably moved! Even if you could assemble an infinite number of search parties and send them in infinite directions, you still could never check everywhere.
Jared Alesi,
And we haven't even gotten to the question of what God would look like if we encountered him by the wildest stroke of luck. Maybe he just looks like empty space when resting! Maybe he hides out in a black hole most of the time. How do we check those possibilities out? And, if we did see an old guy with a humungus, white beard, how would we know he is God? Maybe he doesn't do magical tricks for visitors. Maybe he is not God and can't do magical tricks.
I like the rule of good reasoning brought up from time to time. A claim made without evidence may be rejected without evidence. If the beef isn't there, the smart buyer goes to the next hamburger joint. Someone who clings to a belief without any evidence (or worse--in spite of evidence) is like someone who believes in the Easter Bunny.
It looks like I have strayed, so let's get to the central question. What is that doggie drinking? Inquiring minds would like to know!
The tears of pain and strife, cried by generations of tortured souls in the inferno. That, or it's Chai tea, hard to tell.
That seems incapable of dealing with the case of invisible miniature elephants.
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