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How do the magnetic polarities get translated?
Are they coded?
@J N Vanderbilt III
"How do the magnetic polarities get translated?
Are they coded?"
Day 1 I asked you to define "code". Since you did not, I use my definition.
The magnetic signatures are imprinted into the rock as it cools, similar to data input.
The code is that there is data that can be extracted using specialized tools and training.
You are minimizing what coded information is. According to you, a rock or anything else would be considered information. What you fail to grasp is that coded information (nucleotides) are highly ordered sequences that contain assemblage
instructions for a final product (functional proteins) . Can you demonstrate this with a rock?
All objects are information, even rocks.
I shall not, because only now you are finally offering a vague description of "code". Since you did not, I am using my own definition, which is "information imprinted onto a medium that requires special tools or knowledge to extract".
By injecting a definition at this late phase you are altering a debate where you can roll back anyone's argument by changing the rules. Sorry, too late, I do not cater to such dishonest practices.
@JNV Re: Codes
Just out of curiosity, are you really not understanding what David and Nyar are telling you, or are you just being deliberately difficult? C'mon, man! Dang, even my rusted brain with blown fuses and stripped gears can follow what they are telling you. It really ain't all that complicated.
So forgetting your misnomer about codes for a moment. You seem to be implying that complexity infers design, is that what you believe?
I am sure anyone who owns a dog knows that they stop and smell everything. Dog urine can also be considered a code since it carries information that is extracted by another dog that smells that urine.
I can't read the code, when I sniff dog urine I can't tell if it is an immature female or a dominant male.
I can't get the image out of my head of you sniffing dog urine and the avatar is the aftermath with the owner. Lol
Nevertheless, brilliantly put.
I owe it all to my dog with the cold wet nose.
@Random and David Re: Sniffing dog urine
STOP!!!... You guys are killing me!!!..... Bwaaaaa-haaaaa-haaaaa-haaaa...!!!
8fn 4f k85j5 75k jf cfe7 5m5n 16k5i k85 nfi4 3f54 81j 255e 2c51icp 945ek9g954?
Talking of codes.
Did you know there are 10 kinds of people in the world?
Those who understand binary code, and those that don't.
@Sheldon Re: 10 kinds of people
Now THAT was cool. *chuckle*
What did he say?
@Cog Re: "What did he say?"
LMAO.... Well, apparently you are one of those who don't.... *still laughing*....
In communications and information processing, code is a system of rules to convert information—such as a letter, word, sound, image, or gesture—into another form or representation, sometimes shortened or secret, for communication through a communication channel or storage in a storage medium.
DNA Fits this definition
It seems you want to have your cake and eat it too. If you use a narrow definition of code, DNA won't qualify for the reasons many people have cited above. If you use a wide definition, all kind of stuff (like rocks) will qualify. Both cases ruin your original argument.
This seems to leave you the option of trying to thread the needle, by making a consistent definition that admits DNA but rejects rocks. I don't think that is possible; and even if you are successful, it will reek of special pleading: it isn't going to convince anyone who doesn't already believe in god.
@J N Vanderbilt III
In your original post the sole definition you offered was "a code". I even requested a definition of "code". And only now do you come up with any kind of definition. IMO you are changing the rules to favor your argument. I do not consider this as honest.
Oh, and by the way, RNA still fits within your new definition, and it definitely is not DNA.
And even then, rocks can still fall within your definition. The data in DNA can be expressed as C, G, A, or T. In a rock it can be N or S.
It's even worse. A rock in flight contains the information of whether or not it will strike a target. That information is in the form of it's position and moment; which we can then use kinematics/dynamics to "decode it" to see if it will strike a target. If DNA is a code, then everything is a code; making the word totally meaningless.
How does this evidence design?
Oh and dna transcription even comes w error correction. Still waiting for an example of nature creating a code
" dna transcription even comes w error correction. Still waiting for an example of nature creating a code"
Well according to you DNA is a code, so you've already given one? Unless of course you have evidence it isn't natural?
But can you give an example. ??
Since we know codes that provide instructions when decoded ONLY come from intelligence, then DNA has mostl likely emanated from intelligence.
@J N Vanderbilt III
You are trying so hard, you are like the little engine that could story. Except, unfortunately, the track ended before the "hill" even started, the wheels have fallen off, and the "fuel" is popcorn instead of what is needed.
To any outside observer that actually studies reality, code, dna and not trying to rationalize their particular "god idea" can easily see that your attempted argument for god existing because of "outside intelligence is the only thing that explains dna" can be best described as trying to fit an elephant into a round half inch pipe. Sure after enough ridiculous effort you could get the elephant to fit, but do you even have an elephant anymore fitting in that pipe?
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▮ I am an atheist that always likes a good debate. ▮
▮ Please include @LogicFTW in responses directed to me. ▮
▮ Useful list on forum usage. A.R. Member since 2016. ▮
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@J N Vanderbilt III
"Since we know codes that provide instructions when decoded ONLY come from intelligence, then DNA has mostl likely emanated from intelligence."
Unfortunately this is the crux of your argument, and it is full of holes. We cannot assert with 100% confidence that coding comes only from intelligence. Many have offered many examples of coding. Based on the method in how you are now offering definitions that are eliminating other possibilities, you are like the snake eating it's tail, and your circular argument is now ...
"Only code that comes from intelligence most likely comes from intelligence."
You are now just eliminating any "code" that does not support your position.
YOU "Still waiting for an example of nature creating a code"
ME "Well according to you DNA is a code, so you've already given one? "
YOU "But can you give an example. ??"
I'll try again then *you claimed DNA is a code, so that would be an example of nature producing a code if you believe your own claim.
"A computer code is a set of numerical values sufficient and necessary to the production of an end state from an initial state.
DNA is necessary but not sufficient to the production of an end state from an initial state.
To claim that computer code and DNA are both codes is an abuse of the power of words. It is decidedly not scientific."
https://www.science20.com/chatter_box/dna_when_code_not_code
That was in response to a creationist book making the same claim J N Vanderbilt III is making.
However I have simple question for him, if you are correct why doesn't current scientific thinking agree? Only if it does, everyone seems to have missed it, barring a few creationists that is.
@J N Vanderbilt III keeps going on about DNA transcription having error correction, but the truth is, if it was 100% successful, there'd only be one species at most around today. It is only because of mutations in the DNA that we have ended up with the varieties of life we have today, rather than because of some intelligent designer.
Although there is a form of error correcting in DNA replication, it is obviously imperfect. I also wonder why he harps on this subject because anyone exposed to cancer knows full well that cancer is cells gone wild, that the DNA error correcting failed.
Very early in the history of life a few characteristics had to be quickly adopted, many that still carry on to this day. One good example is the ability for the animal to heal itself. If you cannot heal yourself, you do not live long, not long enough to propagate.
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