WHAT EVOLVED FIRST?

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ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
I always have ulterior

I always have ulterior motives lol. That said, one of my previous threads dealt with the evolution of the eye. That's far more complicated and specific than my current question, and people did just fine answering that one.

LostLocke's picture
OK fine.

OK fine.
What came first? Muscles.

Next.....

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
Evidence.

Evidence.

LostLocke's picture
Animals moved prior to having

Animals moved prior to having skeletons.

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
Such as?

Such as?

Kataclismic's picture
Fine, lets suppose muscles

Fine, lets suppose muscles and invertebrates did come first. My follow up, once more, would be what came first then? Muscles or the nervous system/nerve net?

I thought the question was about muscles and skeletons. It seems you are more interested in changing the question than seeking any answers.

Beetles have exoskeletons. Where do they fit into your question?

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
Sorry, you should know by now

Sorry, you should know by now I'm always two steps ahead. I don't see how that prevents anyone from answering. They're not trick questions.

Kataclismic's picture
Two steps ahead of what? Your

Two steps ahead of what? Your own question?

Kataclismic's picture
I think CyberLN is two steps

I think CyberLN is two steps ahead of your entire post.

Burn Your Bible's picture
@ john61

@ john61

How do IR remotes produce a response from your tv?

LostLocke's picture
An invisible elf flies out

An invisible elf flies out and changes the channel when you press the numbers.
Or is it a pixie? I can never remember which it is....

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
Digital morse code

Digital morse code

Burn Your Bible's picture
So your wrong but yet you use

So your wrong but yet you use remotes??? How if you don't understand this technology can you justify using it?

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
I doubt I'm wrong. I'll pick

I doubt I'm wrong. I'll pick a better example for you: I don't know how the heart rate monitor on my Fitbit works, and I'm scared it'll give me cancer.

Proceed lol...

Burn Your Bible's picture
Nope sorry buddy no running

Nope sorry buddy no running away from this one... answer my question? If you don't understand the technological aspects of your remote how do you justify using it?

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
I'm not running away, I'm

I'm not running away lol, I'm fixing your bad example making your job easier. Remotes clearly works when I change the channel, but I have no way of knowing whether my Fitbit is accurate or not.

Now, ask me the question again using the Fitbit.

LostLocke's picture
I think what BYB is saying is

I think what BYB is saying is....

If you don't know exactly how your remote works how are you justified using it?
=
If you don't understand exactly how evolution works how are you justified in "believing" in it?

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
Obviously, but I hope he/she

Obviously, but I hope he/she can see the trap they laid for themselves: I use my Fitbit on faith. I paid good money for it and I hope the people that sold it to me aren't frauds. Everyone around me has one, so there's an element of herd mentality.

Surely, that can't be his/her/its point. That you guys believe evolution on faith and herd mentality.....

Burn Your Bible's picture
Alright let's get this part

Alright let's get this part out of the way.... we ( atheists and affiliates) DO NOT believe in science on FAITH now I know this is really difficult when you have been brainwashed to blindly follow your holy book. We rely on evidence and facts in order for us to believe a idea or concept! Now hopefully we don't have to get on a whole debate on that in this thread I have already started the why faith thread as I am sure many on this site also have,and I know that they have explained numerous times how faith is bullshit!
Also you bought your Fitbit seeing (evidence) that it has worked, you trust the engineers that made the HR monitor because you know that if it was bullshit you could sue them for false advertising. Just because you don't know how the HR monitor works does not mean you have faith, you through evidence and facts chose to buy it no faith needed.

Now back my question which apparently blew your mind

You don't have to be an expert in a field in order to believe it to be true. You don't have to jump off a building in order to know that you will fall! We unlike yourself according to you use our minds to listen to multiple sides, we look at the EVIDENCE AND FACTS that science brings to the table, side note if science was new as of yesterday ( as in no science ever before that ) we would be skeptical, we would question and demand evidence and facts in order to believe their claims.

The difference between theists and science is theists claim to have evidence for god then claim faith as their evidence. Science claims the have evidence for their claims and when asked they show you the evidence and facts. Science doesn't say don't question you must have faith in order to follow, sciences number one mantra is question and prove everything!! If you came to a scientists and said you have the cure for cancer they would ask for your research, tests results, lab results, and anything else you have to give.... at this point they would then test your tests in order to know that this cure actually works.

In your world someone walks up and says hey I have the cure for cancer and apparently you say really! How do I know it's real. " just trust me" ok good enough for me to believe.

That is utter shit, stop everything you are doing and really think on what you believe in life that you have no objective reasoning for ( other than your god) please inform me sir.

It was not a trap for me it was a trap for a weak minded indoctrinated theist

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
What a long and irrelevant

What a long and irrelevant post, but it seemed to be therapeutic for you so I'm glad it helped.

Burn Your Bible's picture
Did you not assert that

Did you not assert that atheists use faith to believe in science?

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
I asserted that I use my

I asserted that I use my Fitbit on faith, since I have no idea how it works, and I'm trusting people I never met and that never explained it to me. What object lesson you extract from that is up to you. This is your metaphor.

Burn Your Bible's picture
You said earlier that you

You said earlier that you could not test your fit bits accuracy... why couldn't you ? Why couldn't you test every aspect of that device to make sure it was working properly?

The reason why I brought up the IR remote analogy is because you understand the basic principles of what the remote does and if you press power it will turn on. You have enough knowledge to come to the conclusion that when you press volume up your sound gets louder. You don't have to be an expert in how IR remotes work yet you can still use it and even claim to others that it turns your tv on but if it breaks you have to consult someone more knowledgeable.
You ask very detailed questions... and when people answer you, you scoff at it as if your an authority on evolution. And let's be clear you don't care what anyone answers unless it fits into your word game

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
You're talking nonsense. If

If you don't know the answer to my question and don't care to know, then move on. Don't sit here crying about it.

Burn Your Bible's picture
How am I crying? I'm

How am I crying? I'm responding to your responses to others directly not complaining... also why do you always avoid my questions? Are they just to hard for you?

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
I tend to avoid irrelevant

I tend to avoid irrelevant questions.

Burn Your Bible's picture
Ok so let me relate this to

Ok so let me relate this to you what do you think came first?

mykcob4's picture
In answer to Jon's OP, the

In answer to Jon's OP, the answer is muscle evolved first. If we start with the simplest of animals single cell the next transformation was structure or components. This was the evolution of the cell walls. Thus muscle was born. As muscles became bigger and more complex cartilege evolved and eventually bone. Skeletons were very far down the line.

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
I'm not sure what the

I'm not sure what the connection is between cell walls and muscles. But at least you gave me an answer so I'll take it.

chimp3's picture
Humans evolved from a primate

Humans evolved from a primate species with an evolved muscular skeletal system. So, in our case it is a moot question. This chicken or egg paradox does not pertain to humans.

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