Broccoli, Brussel Sprouts, Kale! Are they different species?
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Another salient question, since they claim humans were "created" in God's image, would be is their god part of the family of great apes, the same as humans, and of course gorillas, chimpanzees, orangutans, Gibbons and bonobos?
Or perhaps they think their deity looks more like Australopithecus, a species that played a significant part in human evolution, the genus Homo being derived from Australopithecus at some time after three million years ago.
Australopithecus were the first hominids to possess certain genes, known as the duplicated SRGAP2, which increased the length and ability of neurons in the brain.
One of the australopith species evolved into the genus Homo in Africa around two million years ago (e.g. Homo habilis), and eventually modern humans, H. sapiens sapiens.
So when are they claiming their deity inserted souls? Also, why all the preamble from a deity with limitless power? And why the BS in the bible about clay, and pieces of rib, is this going to be laughably claimed as Allegory again?
Ah creatards, you have to laugh.
Weak argument against the Word of God emerging from flawed interpretation. Man was created in the image of God, ie, we have a spirit(for God is Spirit). Or in other words, we are spiritual beings, having sense of right or wrong.
There are no contradictions on inconsistencies in the Bible. Contradictions arise when non-believers try to twist verses while possessing incomplete reasoning skills.
@AtheistsErr: You want to go to a Textual Criticism class. This is an atheist form. We don't even wipe our butts with your bible. It's useless. When you come up with the right way of interpreting it, let the world know and everyone will follow you. In the mean time....here is a cookie, now go and play nice with the other little theists.
Ad hominem fallacies everywhere. You can't even debate properly. Yes, there are many "Christian" sects with many interpretations. Not all are right. Christian by name does not mean Christian by heart. They are like "weed" in the kingdom of God.
When I give the correct interpretation of "Man was made in image of God", you refute it by saying there are many interpretations. Also, I don't need everyone to follow Christianity. "Narrow is the gate that leads to life", and is not for everyone indeed.
I can always interpret your "contradictions" to show that they aren't really contradictions, just failure of reasoning.
You can choose to believe or not, that is free will.
Many "atheists" try to prove contradictions by misapplying the context, which is laughable but of course, that is the only way for them to "prove contradictions".
“Has anyone provided proof of God’s inexistence? Not even close. Has quantum cosmology explained the emergence of the universe or why it is here? Not even close. Have our sciences explained why our universe seems to be fine-tuned to allow for the existence of life? Not even close. Are physicists and biologists willing to believe in anything so long as it is not religious thought? Close enough. Has rationalism and moral thought provided us with an understanding of what is good, what is right, and what is moral? Not close enough. Has secularism in the terrible 20th century been a force for good? Not even close, to being close. Is there a narrow and oppressive orthodoxy in the sciences? Close enough. Does anything in the sciences or their philosophy justify the claim that religious belief is irrational? Not even in the ball park. Is scientific atheism a frivolous exercise in intellectual contempt? Dead on.” - David Berlinksi
"Also, I don't need everyone to follow Christianity. "Narrow is the gate that leads to life", and is not for everyone indeed."
You just stated that one must be a christian to achieve "the gate that leads to life". What the fuck do you mean? Are you referring to heaven, or just living a productive and happy life on this planet?
Either way, your god is an asshole, a cruel sadistic mean and nasty god.
Why? Because not everyone has the opportunity to get to heaven. That's pretty sick.
I can't even explain how hilarious your comment is. I meant to state how hard it is, to enter eternal life. Obviously, I referred to heaven when I said "life" because that's the only way it can be interpreted. You misapply the context again.
Not everyone will enter heaven/eternal life, because there are people like you who do not believe in it. You are given free will, but you choose to not follow Him. How then can you blame God when it was entirely your choice in denying Him?
A theist that thinks he is way smarter than all atheist here combined.
Unintentional comedy is sometimes the best comedy.
Here let me break it down for you real simple AtheistErr:
Humans are capable of creating fiction/lying.
Someone(s) figured out if they can make folks believe in a particular god fantasy it grants them a lot of power/money.
Throw in the possibility of immortality (life after death in a heaven where you get reunited with lost ones.)
Create as much fear as possible about what happens if you don't fully 100% believe beyond any doubt a certain god prospect.
Get people to alienate their own friends and family if they do not fall in line with this. Threat of violence/death is permitted.
Brainwash people from the moment they can even begin to hear and understand to perpetuate the lie.
Voila you got religion.
Where people believe completely unevidenced bat shit crazy shit, and get real defensive when someone that has pulled themselves from the mental prison that is religion, points out the insane hypocrisy, falsehoods, and a million other obvious major flaws and issues of religion.
And then you get the real special brainwashed folks that go to an atheist forum and spout out their nonsense and get upset when atheist there point out just how completely insane their religion is.
@Logic: Re: "A theist that thinks...," Whoooo Babbby - We gotta disagree on that one! You got any evidence for that claim? When you say "Think" what exactly do you mean? I gotta tell you, I have been hanging around here for a couple of years and I have not seen any evidence of that claim. Where did you get your information? Can you cite your source? :-)
That explains it neatly actually, theist do not think at least not about anything that would challenge their god idea they are heavily invested/biased in.
"Not everyone will enter heaven/eternal life, because there are people like you who do not believe in it. You are given free will, but you choose to not follow Him. How then can you blame God when it was entirely your choice in denying Him?"
Then I will repeat my previous statement:
Either way, your god is an asshole, a cruel sadistic mean and nasty god.
because I was a theist for twenty years, then spent the next forty searching (even praying on my knees in churches) for any sign. My heart was open, my mind was open, yet your asshole god decided that I would not learn.
Argumentum ad ignorantiam fallacy, yet again, sigh. Can you prove invisible unicorns don''t exist? Do take your time....
It's not, most of it is entirely hostile to life, and again this is an argumentum ad ignorantiam fallacy, dear oh dear but the ignorance of your posts is painful to read.
Yes, unevidenced faith is the very antithesis of science, and superstitious claims for supernatural magic is entirely incompatible with the scientific method, for fairly obvious reasons to anyone remotely literate.
No such thing, atheism is simply the lack or absence of belief in a deity or deities. Your all around ignorance is difficult to accept, I suspect you're yet anther theist troll, sadly.
"Or in other words, we are spiritual beings, having sense of right or wrong."
You obviously have no kids because a two year old is a lying manipulative thief. What most label as morals are taught to us.
"Contradictions arise when non-believers try to twist verses while possessing incomplete reasoning skills."
I am a licensed electrician and in a previous career, a jet engine mechanic. In both of those trades one must be very adept in following instructions and interpreting what is on paper. So when I read some twisted passage in a bible that contradicts itself or just has zero common sense, did I suddenly become dyslexic or is the bible just one fucked up piece of literary garbage? I go with the second option, my decision supported by the fact that a book of 1200 pages has over 33,000 different interpretations (sects).
The point is, "image of God" refers to having a spirit. I never said that having a spirit must give us right or wrong discerning ability right from birth, nor did I say that we do not sin. Having a spirit simply means that we were created superior to other living beings and that we possess knowledge of right and wrong. Many people who have previously experienced near-death experiences state that their spirit separated from their body or they could see their physical body from a different perspective. You choose not to believe, I can't change that.
I can say with surety that the 'contradictions' in Bible are actually not contradictions. You just call it a contradiction because you do not want to believe in it.
"You choose not to believe, I can't change that."
Believe? Believe what, your blatant bullshit? Just because I do not blindly accept your crap, that does not make me wrong. Neither does it make me right, it just makes me critical in my thinking.
"I never said that having a spirit must give us right or wrong discerning ability right from birth"
OK, now that you are attempting to backtrack and redefine something you stated earlier, I will play along. At what age does a person suddenly get the god-given ability to discern right from wrong?
Don't go twisting my words. I said, we have the ability to discern between right and wrong but never even mentioned we have that ability right from birth. It's the virtue of knowing right or wrong that matters. You can't even point out where I tried to redefine myself, thus creating a straw man.
How did our ancestors know right from wrong? The fact is we know what is right or wrong by others teaching us, but how did the one's who teach us these moral values gain the knowledge. This is where my point comes in. Since we are made in image of God we possess ability to know right from wrong. For example, a criminal can say it's okay to murder, but we inherently know it is wrong, but that doesn't mean one doesn't fall into sin either.
I think what's more ridiculous is that atheists claim time,matter and chance created the brain.
At what age does a person suddenly get the god-given ability to discern right from wrong?
Do you not understand my statement or simply ignore the truth behind it? No one magically gains the ability to know right or wrong. The thing is, we are rightly able to discern between right and wrong. It's the virtue/quality of righteousness I speak about.
...*sniff-sniff*.... Ewwwww!... *pinching nosed closed with thumb and index finger*... Aw, man! Smells like somebody shit out a giant dirty gym sock... *eyes beginning to water*... *opening windows*... *turning on vent fans*... *continuous spraying of air freshener*... There. Maybe that will help a little.
Hey, I have a fun idea, boys and girls! Let's play a game. It's called "Guess who has his hand up the ass of AtheistsErr." After reading his posts, though, I have to admit it is impressive how he seems to intentionally try to use as many fallacies as he possibly can in each post. Rather fascinating, actually.... *suddenly waving hand rapidly in front of face*.... *eyes starting to water again*... Aw, fuck.... Still reeks in here... *cough-cough*...
My post is a response to your statement ...
"Man was created in the image of God, ie, we have a spirit(for God is Spirit). Or in other words, we are spiritual beings, having sense of right or wrong."
That is what you posted.
1) You stated that man is created in the image of god, including a "spirit".
2) You stated that we are able to discern right from wrong.
But when I pointed out the flaw in your argument by showcasing how immoral young children are, all of a sudden you are backtracking, and not owning up to the simple fact that you incorrectly claimed that men are born with morals.
Now your most recent statement "No one magically gains the ability to know right or wrong." is a direct contradiction on your previous post where you claimed god imbued man with morals.
Try, just try (I know this may be new to you and painful) to be honest and own up to your mistakes. We all make mistakes.
1) I never said we have the ability from birth. nor did I deny that we do not learn values from others(adults for example).
2) I only said we possess the ability to discern right and wrong, never even mentioned we have that from birth. We have the virtue of righteousness, ie, we gradually do gain the sense to differentiate between right and wrong.
You assumption that I meant God imbued man with moral is nothing, but just a wrong assumption. You simply assumed that I meant we have right/wrong discerning ability from birth. Of course, you can never point out where I said something like that.
Your assumptions =/= what I meant.
Then again, my entire point was that "image of God" refers to having a spirit.
Understand this: at no point in a person's life does any god inject/imbue morals into a person. I understand that this ancient concept was accepted not long ago (read Edgar Rice Burrough's Tarzan series), but since then its has been proven that environment is the determining factor.
You have just invented a scenario where your god is present. If you disagree, then I revert to my question you have not answered.
"At what age does a person suddenly get the god-given ability to discern right from wrong?"
Who even said that God directly imbues those values? You question is logically inaccurate because I never said we gain the ability at a certain age.
"Then God said, "Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness...""(Gen 1:26) . Image refers to having a spirit. Since we are made in His likeness, we definitely have the sense of right or wrong. Children may sin, but they dont always realize it. As we age, we gain more experience, and we realize what is right or wrong. This is what I mean by having sense of right or wrong, not that God "injects" it into us. We have the ability to gradually learn to discern between right and wrong. Other living beings do not. That you do not understand my statement, doesnt make it false. A 2 year old is a lying and manipulative person? Well, not always. It depends on how he/she was raised. Having a sense of right or wrong doesn't always mean they do the right things. Especially, when surrounded by liars(you). Why, people murder even though they know it is wrong(ie they understand it is wrong, but still sin).
Also I do not need to answer your question, because it is a straw man question.
Also an atheist has tried to provide contradictions in Bible by pointing out random verses from the Old Law and the New Law while possessing zero knowledge about what it talks about. It is sad, but cannot be helped.
I honestly think this will be my last reply, for none really seem to understand what I say and totally misinterprets everything.
"Professing to be wise, they became fools"(Romans 1:22)
Re: AtheistsErr - "I honestly think this will be my last reply..."
...*wishful look in eyes*.... Gee, if only that were true... *resigned sigh*... Wonder how many more times he will make that same remark over the next few days? Anybody wanna take bets?
"I honestly think this will be my last reply, for none really seem to understand what I say and totally misinterprets everything."
I am sorry to hear that, sincerely.
But in this forum, if you just spout shit or are vague, then others receive different interpretations. The point is, if you make ANY assertion (which I jumped on), then expect it to be challenged and you have to lay out and describe your reasoning. If you believe this place is just one mess of misunderstanding, then I remind you that it is the responsibility of the poster to ensure their message is precise and unambiguous.
You come from the theistic world where appeals to authority prevail. No one challenges the spiritual leader, you just accept it. That does not happen in here.
All animals that evolved to live in societal groups exhibit this ability. So your erroneous claims about human morality being derived from part of a creation myth is exposed as false right there. It's also a scientific fact that humans like all living things evolved slowly overtime.
Please explain why something is right, or conversely why something is wrong? For instance why are actions like rape and murder immoral? Assuming you believe they are immoral of course? The bible clearly shows your deity doesn't think they are.
Nowhere does God accept murder or rape. I do not know how you came up with that reasoning, because that is not seen in the Bible. Probably arose due to your low intellectual ability and failure of reasoning skills? I also cannot help if you associate the Old Law with New Law. I suggest truly understanding it, without simply posting it while only trying to refute it.
"It's also a scientific fact"
Since when is evolution a fact?
"Probably arose due to your low intellectual ability and failure of reasoning skills?"
Are you just looking for a pooh throwing contest?
As a fellow Christian I have to ask if insults are the correct Christian response?
Is that what Jesus did and what he taught?
"He looked around at them in anger and, deeply distressed at their stubborn hearts.."(Mark 3:5)
These atheists think they are wise by trying to post "contradictions" in the Bible without knowing anything about it. I think it is indeed apt, although my aim was not to insult but just point out how foolish the knowledge of this world is.
"..Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world?"(Cor 1:20)
@Jo: "As a fellow Christian I have to ask if insults are the correct Christian response?"
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA FUNNIEST THING YOU HAVE SAID SO FAR.
When should normal people not take threats of hell, damnation and eternal suffering as non-threatening. FUCKING STUPIDEST POST ON THE FORUM TO DATE! YOU SHOULD BE A COMEDIAN!
You do not believe in God and hence do not believe in heaven or hell. Is death by hanging a threat to someone who is a serial killer? Similar case here. You fail to recognize and accept the truth and denies the existence of a Creator. And the soul who sins shall die. Non-believers will be condemned to hell on that day which will come like a thief which isn't a threat, but rather judgement. I do not profit if you choose to accept the word of God, rather you will. No one has ever proved the Bible wrong unlike atheists claim.