@ Tin-Man and AUS lass

To continue in a very abbreviated way, Tamar, wanting to have children, then dressed as a prostitute so as to entice Judah. It worked, he went in unto her and got her knocked up. Later on Judah accuses Tamar of prostitution since she has a child before Shelah is old enough to know picking his nose and eating the boogers ain't get him laid. Tamar then tells Judah the child is his and the prostitute he went in unto was her. Judah then quickly changes his mind about stoning and said she ain't guilty of prostitution and that his booger eating son was actually the father. I may not be remembering that last part too correctly.

Checked it. Was kind of correct. Shelah actually was old enough when Judah went in unto Tamar and made the babies. The babies were Perez and Zerah. Then it skips to Joseph in Chapter 39 and I get lost.

Tin-Man. You have greater fortitude than I. I can usually only can read about one chapter before I start getting sick. Most of the verses I use are catalogued so I ain't got to search except by keywords taking me right to the verse I need, then I can look it up in the Bible, then copy and paste. Basically the same list I gave in God's Nastiest Turd. Kudos to you dude for enduring that much.

rmfr

@ Old Man

I place a bet that it is all three...

rmfr

mailman

There is a lot here but I want to address the Jesus Myth claim.

Atheistic scholars almost all (there could be 1 or 2 who are the exception) agree that Jesus existed. This is not even an issue for debate among their colleagues. Even Bart Ehrman agrees Jesus existed. Bart Ehrman is an atheist.

I don't even know how to go about addressing any other issues if you are in disagreement with such an accepted fact about Jesus actually existing. It almost seems like you put faith in your belief above the evidence for a historical Jesus. Don't you accuse Christians of putting faith before facts/evidence?

Can you help me with this?

Wow, you have been deluded, Grasshopper. Specifically where you are wrong.

mailman"Atheistic scholars almost all (there could be 1 or 2 who are the exception) agree that Jesus existed. This is not even an issue for debate among their colleagues. Even Bart Ehrman agrees Jesus existed. Bart Ehrman is an atheist."

Completely wrong. They all state that they are not disagreeing with the possiblity that a "Jesus" character existed. Even Bart Ehrman says so. Not one atheist has ever said "Jesus existed." They have all said the may have existed, could have existed, possibly existed, etc. Read their books again.

mailman"I don't even know how to go about addressing any other issues if you are in disagreement with such an accepted fact about Jesus actually existing."

Probably because of the millions of Jews who say Jesus never existed and even if he did he was NOT the Messiah?

mailman"It almost seems like you put faith in your belief above the evidence for a historical Jesus."

First of all, I ain't got any faith. And my beliefs are totally dependent upon objective hard empirical evidence. The more I have, the more I believe in something because my belief is wholly dependent upon objective facts. There is absolutely NO evidence Jesus ever existed outside of the four Gospels. And even the first one, Mark, was not written until almost 100 years after the fictional event.

mailman"Don't you accuse Christians of putting faith before facts/evidence?"

Because that is what y'all do.

Remember these:

FACTS — Formulated Accurately Codified Truth in Science

FAITH — Falsehoods Assumptions Innuendos Treachery and Hogwash

Sorry, me AR brothers, he asked for it.

OK. Time for the long history lesson and smackdown. Old Man knows more than I do on this, but this is what I have found about the Jesus Myth.

Let’s look at what the biblical scholars say about the four gospels. All bible scholars agree that Mark was the first gospel. Then came Matthew, Luke, and finally John. This has always made me wonder, if Mark was the first gospel, why is Matthew listed first? Most bible scholars agree the dates they were written is: Mark = 60 CE, Matthew = 70 CE, Luke = 75 CE, and John = 90 CE. OK. Most bible scholars agree Jesus was crucified in 30 CE. Of course, they cannot even agree on this for some put the crucifixion as early as 25 CE and as late as 38 CE. And this is due to the fact that they cannot agree when he was born. As far as I am concerned, this proves Jesus/Yeshua was a complete lie, a fabricated myth. However, I shall stay with the most agreed upon date of 30 CE.

Here entails the problem. This means that Mark was written 30 years after the event in question. Matthew written 40 years after, Luke written 45 years after, and John 60 years after. Can you honestly expect anyone to believe that the life and times of a person can be remembered in such exquisite detail that many years later? Relying on just memory?

Try this thought experiment. Using the year 2018 as the basis, remember an event you witnessed, relying on no other sources than your own fallable memory, and describe that event in exquisite detail that occurred in 1988. In 1978. In 1973. And, in 1958. Cannot do it can you? Human memory is funny that way.

Of course, there is your “inspired by the Holy Ghost” because the Bible says so. This is the Circular Logic Fallacy. “The Bible is the word of god because the Bible says it is the word of god.” Can you not see the fallacy in that claim? Using that same claim, I can say that Harry Potter is real because those seven books says he is real. No book can be its own source of validity. It does not work that way. The validity of anything can only be proven by sources other than itself. Regardless of how much you wish it to be true, the Bible can never be used to prove itself valid. Thus, the Bible is invalid.

And here is another interesting fact. Why does the oldest version of the Gospel of Mark only dates back to only 112 CE? This means the first gospel was not written until 82! years after the event in question. And the other three date much later. The Gospel of John, the last one written dates to about circa 188 CE, 158! years later. Thus, how did the Bible scholars determine that the gospels were written much earlier? Or, it is the lie fabricated by those megalomaniacal psychotic sociopaths?

Additionally, there are no outside sources that even mention “Jesus/Yeshua” except for the one document (that I have seen in person) written by Josephus. And I cannot even remember when it was written. And he only mentions that the “Christians” around the Levant were speaking about a “street evangelist” by the name of “Yeshua” of which “no official record” can be found. Basically, Josephus wrote about a “new cult” that was springing up around the Levant about a non-existent person.

Otherwise, the only other “official records” (which they are not) are the four gospels themselves. And I have already shown where a document cannot prove its own validity. However, even the gospels are suspect since the oldest versions have been dated to only around 112 CE to 188 CE. That is 82 to 158 years (76 year span) after the supposed crucifixion, death, and resurrection of Jesus.

This would mean for about eight to sixteen decades, the only stories about Jesus/Yeshua were passed down by “word of mouth.” And we all know what happens with “word of mouth” stories. They get embellished in the same exact fashion as those “The Fish That Got Away” stories. By the way, did I tell you the story of the fish that was

“THIS BIG”

that broke my fishing line and got away? No. Remind me sometime...

Then there are other problems with the four gospels. Using advanced forensic writing analysis, all four gospels show signs of having been written by more than one person. Mark is worst, showing signs that up to six different persons wrote it. Additionally, the last chapter is not even part of the original gospel. Mark Chapter 16 was not added until several centuries later circa 500 to 600 CE. Matthew and Luke show signs of having been written by up to three or four different persons. John is the least with up to two or three different persons. And to really throw a monkey wrench into this, the Paulian epistles have been shown to have been written by up to eight different persons. Hmm… And, The Revelation of Saint John the Divine has been shown to have been written by four different persons.

As said, do the research for yourself. Wikipedia can be a good starting point. However, do not completely rely on the Wikipedia web page itself. Even though anyone with an account can alter the text of a page, Wikipedia has been shown to be as truthful and reliable any other encyclopedia. Instead use it as jump-off point to the more trustworthy web sites at universities and scientific institutes. Especially focus into the “See also,” “Notes,” “References,” “Further reading,” “Bibliography,” and/or “External links” sections at the bottom. These may actually lead to some official scientific peer-reviewed journal articles/papers. And do NOT use the religious apologetic sites that pretend to be science sites, of which include Answers In Genesis, Discovery Institute, and the Institute of Creation Research. Such sites, as these three listed, are actually pseudoscience apologetics pawning themselves off as if true science. Additionally, anyone religious person, even those with supposed PhDs, can write their articles without any peer-review process that actual science papers must pass before being accepted for publication. I know. It took over three years from my master's thesis and dissertation (yes two papers) to be approved.

And that is something I love about true science. It is the only set of disciplines where you will have official articles/papers that are peer-reviewed (sometimes for years) before they are even eligible for publication. This is something you shall never see in any religion. Anybody can write anything religious and publish it without any recourse or peer-review. Of course, the same could be said of my writings. However, I am not trying to pawn off my writings as official science journal articles/papers. My writings are nothing more than a treatise. And I even ask, several times, for you to do some research of your own. Don’t trust my word, find the answers for yourself. That is what it means to be human, instead of a robot force fed with the data others want you to know. Remember, it is more important how to think than to be told what to think. And from the section “Some Favorite Quotes”: Beware those who would deny you access to information, for they already dream themselves your master. That is all any Religious Absolutist is, a megalomaniacal psychotic sociopath who dreams of enslaving the entire human species.

In summation, I shall be the first to admit that a person similar to Jesus/Yeshua may have actually existed. However, I shall never admit that he was some form of deity. I shall also admit that he may have been quite intelligent. But the son of god? No.

In all likelihood, your precious Jesus/Yeshua was probably nothing more than a bastard child left homeless. In having to fend for himself, he devised a method in which he would get others to help fend for him. And in his attempt to completely destroy and disrupt the status quo, he was discovered for the fraud he was and killed. Those who did love him, concocted the myth behind the man, making him seem more and more wise and holy until the myth became a story about the son of god. And how many times has this happened throughout history? Research it. You shall find Jesus/Yeshua ain’t the only flimflam artist who was ascended to such a mighty throne. Muhammad is another. And remember that Muhammad was a murdering thief, an ethnic genocidal cleanser, and a child rapist and molester.

Have you never heard of the “Chinese Whispers” game? Every 8 or 9 year old can tell what that game is. Thus, you must be ≤7 years old. My poor little child, those Religious Absolutists have done a whammy on you, ain't they? The teacher tells the first child a short story (and is written down to show the difference later). That child then tells the story to the next child, who then tells it to the next, and the next, and so on. Once it has gone through at least two dozen children, the last child repeats the story out loud. And the story is completely different than when it started. This same thing has happened with the gospels.

You Religious Absolutists are only good for one thing, spewing mind diarrhea and mental vomit. Lies. More lies. And even more lies. Your Magic Zombie Virgin is just a fantasy.

rmfr