If there was a GOD would you follow him? Check my bet
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If this god did exist, facts from the bible prove that this god is an incompetent idiot (as well as many other failed qualities). For example, this god is the worst communicator. If any god created anything, and especially since that god demands obedience, then it is logical to assume such a being would make sure in every way that everyone knows it exists. Everyone would get the same memo. But instead, we get multiple and conflicting messages at different parts of the world and in different eras. With a smart god, there would be just one defined and unchanging religion.
The bible states that man was created in the image of god. Then why don't I have better eyes? How come my eyes suck in comparison to an eagle, or cat?
And please don't drag out the "god wanted us to learn" because the bible stated that man was created in the image of god.
I definitely do not accept the "smart, capable, and just" because the cold hard facts as laid out in the bible state the opposite.
@ryan you have such a negative view of the bible, it is far more negative than the average person on the street.
I think that may be because most atheists have actually read the Bible, while the average Christian in the street has just been told about it by priests and pastors.
Who is truly more capable of assessing a person, a competent stranger, or that person's mother? Obviously not the mother because her perception is warped by being that mother.
What you are encountering in here is that critical assessment not tied down to prejudices.
You read the bible, you see the good stuff about love and hippies. But we also read the bible, and we see that too, but more important, the stuff you ignore, the stuff about a god committing genocide, of being guilty of atrocious horrors, we see very clearly.
In fact, there are web sites that list the contradictions and the absurdities in the bible. How can anyone even begin to respect such a volume of confusion and contradictions?
Have you read your bible? From start to finish? Not just the parts religious leaders tell you to read? Tell us which bible version you have read, and we can highlight some parts you might have missed...
Of course many of us here tend to have a negative view of the bible. We have actually read the parts that the priest/etc tend to skip over!
Edit: oops I see this has already been pointed out by someone else :)
"Maybe you would say "it has good teachings but I just don't think its true." Why does it gravitate so much towards dislike and hatred? Every single person on here said if I found GOD to be true I would never follow him."
That is because the 'god' you follow, is capricious, indecent, vengeful, has temper tantrums and assigns punishments to children that are plain torture. Just so you know what I am talking about here are some passages from your 'holy book" about your loving god and his/himself/ghost/son I think any reasonable person would never ever describe these passages as "loving"
To the woman He said, ‘I will greatly multiply your pain in childbirth. In pain you shall bring forth children; yet your desire shall be for your husband and he shall rule over you’” (Genesis 2:16)
Yep Ryan, your god got pissed at a girl and sentenced her and every woman thereafter to pain and suffering and servitiude...must be love love love....
“Kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known man intimately. But all the girls who have not known man intimately, spare for yourselves” (Numbers 31: 17-18).
What has your god got against girls?
“I will harden Pharaoh’s heart that I may multiply My signs and My wonders in the land of Egypt” (Exodus 7:3).
God then methodically terrorizes the Egyptian populace. He turns their drinking water to blood, fouls the land with a plague of frogs, sends clouds of gnats to torment man and beast, fills fields and homes with locusts, kills their livestock, infects them with boils and sores, rains down hail to destroy their remaining crops... the torments go on for pages. Note your loving god heardened Pharoahs heart so he wouldn't let the Israelites go! Then tortures all the innocent Egyptians, the children and slaves...yeh true love there.
A man can beat his male or female slave bloody as long as the slave doesn’t die within two days of the beating (Exodus 21:20-21). A judge can condemn a criminal to receive a similar beating after forcing him to lie down (Deuteronomy 25:2). Adulterers are to be stoned—a slow and painful death that adds the extra humiliation of broad public participation (Deuteronomy 17:2-7).
God loves slavery and beating to death..lovely, plus sex is a no no...people must die!
2 Kings, an equally awful, diabolical death happens 42 young boys who taunt God’s prophet, Elisha about going bald...thats all.. He curses them and God sends two bears, who kill the boys by tearing them apart.
“If your hand or your foot causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life maimed or crippled than to have two hands or two feet and be thrown into eternal fire. And if your eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into the fire of hell” (Matthew 18:8-9).
Then the master called the servant in. ‘You wicked servant,’ he said, ‘I canceled all that debt of yours because you begged me to. Shouldn’t you have had mercy on your fellow servant just as I had on you?’ In anger his master handed him over to the jailers to be tortured, until he should pay back all he owed. This is how my heavenly Father will treat each of you unless you forgive your brother or sister from your heart."
Bags of forgiveness there. don't you agree?
And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man. And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them. (Revelation 9:5-6)
The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever. (Revelation 14:10-11)
No comment needed on those last two verses. old YHWH seems to positively revel in the pain and suffering. Great examples of loving, protective kindness eh @Ryan?
(Edited for clarity)
do you guys get a lot of Christians on here? Do you have regulars that are Christian?
@Ryan Re: "do you guys get a lot of Christians on here"
We have a couple of die-hard regulars. Most, however, are basically drive-bys.
" basically drive-bys."
yeah.. and i think he's one of them...
i forgot to warn him first T-man..
that poor guy...i mean look at him...t-man look at him....
he's struggling for survival..*teary eye* (with forearms on T-mans shoulder)
Well, Q, I admit I have my suspicions about him. Of course, I'm just critical and pessimistic by nature. *chuckle* Still, you have to admit he is doing better than most, so far. Not ready to fully write him off just yet, as long as he keeps trying.
@Ryan Re: "do you guys get a lot of Christians on here"
Maybe you could be the first that displays some erudition.
The first that does some research (real research not you tube preachers and a bit of Wikepedia cherry picking the bits that agree with preconceptions)
The first that actually answers the questions we pose in our responses to them.
Apart from that as Tin Man says just a couple of die hards. In my short time here there has been a couple of regulars, one utterly infamous for his Jesuit like ability to twist words arguments and posts into impossible pretzel shapes. One who is on a lot of meds and needs serious help, and another die hard catholic who just loves the pain of being proved wrong time and time again. There are also the odd muslim and other woo woo followers who come and go.
The other christians are drive by posters who throw a few assertions, unverifiable claims and the odd 'survey' about then disappear leaving a trail of broken bibles behind them.
Join the throng!
I think you guys need a weirdo like me. life is to boring with out a weirdo.
@Ryan. Re: "I think you guys need a weirdo like me. life is to boring with out a weirdo."
Hate to burst your bubble, buddy, but we are ALL weirdos on here in some form or fashion. So, in that respect, you are just another face in the crowd. However, the difference (in my opinion) is in the fact most of us weirdos here are more grounded in reality, as opposed to living in a world of delusion and wishful thinking. By your own admissions, you are uncertain of your own beliefs, and apparently woefully unfamiliar with the very book which you claim to follow. THAT is where we have our fun, and that is what keeps our little world here from getting boring. *chuckle*
"weirdo like me"
yeah..sure all of the weirdos, mascots, nerds..etc...hop on..
You think that we hate the bible? What you don't want to understand is that the bible isn't factual. It should be in the fiction section of the library. I don't care if you think that the general teaching of the bible is good. That makes no difference. The ends does not justify the means. Christianity through the bible teaches that knowledge is a bad thing a sin. You can't question god or religious authority. You have to accept things that just aren't true.
What YOU have to do for us what ANYONE has to do is PROVE your god is real. That is basically YOUR ONE FUCKING RESPONSIBILITY! PERIOD!
All this "what if" is just bullshit!
You see ryan, you can't accept reality. You don't want to engage in facts. You want to restate what YOU saw on YouTube from some religious propagandist! That just doesn't cut it.
Here are some what ifs for ya:
What if grasshoppers were armed with guns? Birds wouldn't fuck with 'em then!
What if I farted rainbows and unicorns shit tasted like ice cream?
Really what ifs just don't cut it!
@Ryan Re: Myk's comment - "Christianity through the bible teaches that knowledge is a bad thing a sin. You can't question god or religious authority. You have to accept things that just aren't true."
Glad you brought that up, Myk. Reminded me of something I posted a few months ago concerning knowledge.
Have you ever stopped to consider what the very first "original sin" was that was committed by Adam and Eve? They ate from the tree of knowledge. And God got totally pissed because they now - according to the bible teachings - knew the things God knew. To me, that sends a pretty strong message that God wants people to be dumb, ignorant, and simply follow his will without question. So, I do not believe the bible was inspired/written by God. But let us pretend for just a moment that it was. Now, try to follow my reasoning on this....
1. If God is truly all-knowing and all-powerful as depicted, then WHY would he be concerned about his creations having knowledge? Is he really that insecure and paranoid? And if so, why would anybody want to worship something like that?
2. If he was trying to spare his creations the pain and hardships that come with knowledge, then why put the tree there for them to be tempted? To me, that would be like taking a toddler who can barely say, "Mama", and leaving him unattended in a room full of brightly colored sippy-bottles full of poisoned Kool-Aid and telling him, "Don't drink any of those, young man." To be such a highly intelligent, all-knowing, all-loving God, that seems pretty damn stupid. Even more ridiculous when you consider he allowed a "talking serpent" in there to further entice his two innocent and naïve "kids".
3. So, either: A. God is incredibly insecure and jealous and paranoid (in which case I would want nothing to do with him even if he was real); OR, B. The bible was actually written/inspired by MAN as a means to allow a small handful of "educated" few to control the vast multitude of the severely UNeducated and incredibly gullible many. My vote goes to B.
Bottom line, along with the story of God's very first creation, there are many other verses in the bible that make it very clear that God does not want Man questioning anything about him or his "Word", under penalty of some very harsh punishments. What better way to control the masses and maintain the charade?
Genasis 2 17 "you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die.” Notice it is referring to the knowledge of good and evil not general knowledge. This is the beginning of free will God never wanted us to be robots he wants us to make a choice to follow him or to reject him. Without free will you have robots and that's not what God wants. When you choose to follow God its because you love him.
Please define "evil knowledge".
Let me clue you in on something. I have REALLY REALLY been easy on you. Ask anyone on this forum. I have been relatively nice and even patient with you.
I don't suffer fools easily. I am particularly incensed by liars. Now to my knowledge, you have only lied once but that was obvious. That being the lie that your professor stated: “there is no GOD, evolution is the truth”.
I'm quite sure you have lied about other things. The REAL problem is that you not only LIVE a lie, but you really want all of US to live it as well. Why the fuck do you think you need or even have the right to recruit us to your myth!
@Ryan Re: Myk
Hey, Ryan, just to confirm what Myk said, he really has been taking it VERY EASY on you. Just so you know. Maybe he likes your dog? *chuckle*
@Tin Man and Ryan
Very very easy. Like a scarred old tomcat eyeing up the sparrow that just landed on his food bowl.
Both Tin Man and I were looking for a pile of feathers and some pools of blood...but all you got was a caress from a large, scary paw with no claws in view..You are a luck fella Ryan. See you soon.
I don't know after that last post I think I am a goner. I am dead meat baby
lol very funny.....I know how can you not like a golden retriever puppy. He is my secret weapon. I absolutely love dogs.
"I absolutely love dogs.
Yahweh hates dogs. You're cruising for a bruising.
I don't understand my professor did tell us there is no God and that we exist because of evolution. Does that not sound like something a professor would say?
I am not a perfect person, I have done many things that I am ashamed of and Jesus has forgiven me for those things and I just love him so much for that. Oh my that sounds so crazy when I read it. I don't know you but I do love you because Jesus has taught me how to.
There is lots of info out there that will lead you to Gods existence but I don't think that's what you are looking for. I don't think that is what you need. You need something directly from God. The only way you will see is if you pray but you must put your anger and frustration aside and pray with an open heart. If you pray to god and state, God I just want to know the truth do you exist? Then if your heart is in the right place he will reveal himself to you. However if you do it with no intentions of really wanting to know the truth and do it with a closed heart, he may choose not to reveal himself to you. He knows your heart. God loves honesty you could pray something like "God I am sure I am wasting my time with this prayer but I want to know if you really exist. I want to know if you really love me. If you do I would like to get to know you better". There isn't anything special you have to do just be honest and real. God loves honest and real hearts. You can even tell him you hate him and it may not be a bad thing.
Re: Ryan - "Actually I am going to pray for you now and I haven't prayed for anyone on here yet so your the first."
Uh-oh. Uhhh... Hey, Old Man, I've got the broom and dust pan. You get the mop and bucket. This could be nasty...
lol ya I think I am in deep crap! Kind of scared
I was already standing by with the K'Archer steam cleaner as those dried up gooky stains are a bitch to get off....
*stands to attention and hums "Volga Boatmen" "
Hey at least with christians and muslims we don't have brains to worry about, brains splatter all over and stick like crazy....
(edited for brains)
@Old Man Re: Gooky stains
Yeah, the gelled clumps are the worst. And I'm still finding crusted splatters in a few places after the last one Myk got ahold of. I'm thinking about lining the place with plastic sheeting like a Dexter episode.
Good thinking, and get rid of the carpet and put some channels so the liquid can flow more easily. Oooh polished granite floor with non stick surface that's my choice.